1y ago

Always remember, both sides are just as bad!

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409 comments

Everyone is demonizing and censoring everyone and playing innocent. Fuck literally everyone who uses labels and uses filters to suppress others. Why can't we just sit here and argue about the actual subject points individually like decent goddamn human beings?!
- Why can't we just sit here and argue... like decent goddamn human beings?!
  This you?
  I think you're all fucking stupid
  
  Include the rest of the comment obviously. I'm done replying to someone who's making a blatant spin.
  
  It isn't blatant spin, it's you got called out for arguing against your own positions. If you are genuine you'd do some introspection.
- Everyone calling you stupid and telling you to shove your stupidity up your ass is not censorship. You aren't being suppressed, you are being evaluated, and if that makes you feel like you should shut up, then the free market of ideas is working.
  
  Yeah no, that's all fine. We're talking about Nexus mods here though. What they did was censor.
  
  And they completely have that right, seeing as they own the website? Where did this come from? What are you on?
  
  Yeah, and Facebook similarly has the right to their mass influence and control over who sees what around election time. I think they shouldn't have that right though. Facebook is not a person. Companies aren't people. Their capacity for doing damage should be open to audit. There's a reason your food requires a list of ingredients.
  
  that's all fine
  It never is, sry for the "reddit" hivemind, corners of the Internet are different as you know, 🤷‍♂️.
  And lemmy.world censored lemmygrad.ml and hexbear and others by defederating with them, as well as enterprises and the government.
  
  That's not censorship. Both lemmygrad and hexbear are alive and well and freely available to anyone interested in what they have to say. By your definition I'm "censoring" Fox News by not watching it.
  
  But it's also preventing others from lemmy.world to see posts or comments from lemmygrad/hexbear/..(, as well as preventing them to post or comment), they're not leaving the choice to lemmy.world users(, nor even asking them).
  
  Honestly, that's a complication that needs to be considered and can be used against us if we do the regulating wrong. There's so many people in here who just have a side and wanna rage against me because I'm not bleating their tune. This isn't about gayness or gay aversion at all. My problem is that the avenues for free speech may as well be abandoned because nobody goes there and exposure is determined by money. The Internet is the best we have and it's being used against truth. My bone is to pick with censorship itself and more specifically when it's done with large audiences.
- That's more of a centrist take. It makes perfect sense for trans allies to demonize transphobes, for example. Nobody is advocating against constructive conversation, but sometimes views are genuinely rooted in malice and thus cannot be reasoned with.
  
  Keep your labels to yourself, and no it doesn't make sense to demonize, ever. Take literally myself for example. I'm into futas and whatnot, but lots of gay dudes genuinely freak me out. It's not the gayness, but some other creepy shit that comes packaged with it. I was literally stalked in the shower by multiple dudes in the homeless shelter and staff did nothing. I had a dude in jail who convinced the COs to make him my celly because he thought I would hook up with him and when I denied him he became violent about it. This is just the two most strand out examples. Gay dudes actually creep me out. You gonna demonize me for that?
  
  I'm not sure you want to take a middle ground between being transphobic and being a trans ally, as that's just transphobia. The transphobes should, in fact, be shunned and demonized for being bigots.
  Homophobia ain't cool either.
  
  Your problem is that you're calling it what is not to have an easier time ridiculing and sounding cool. Malice and fear are not the same. Don't give the malice camp allies from the fearful camp.
  
  Neither malice nor fear are good when directed at minority populations, and pretending one is better than the other when they breed each other is again a meaningless centrist take.
  I'm flattered that you think I sound cool, though 😎
  
  You're a guilt by association kind of guy, and you're complaining about guilt by association people...
  For the record, I'm not defending malice. That's just lunacy.
  
  I'm a guilt by guilt kinda guy. Fear of minorities is bad.
  
  Ever heard of "Germany Must Perish"? Hitler was evil, but the fears he used to achieve his ends weren't unfounded. When you go after the fearful, you leave them thinking their only allies are the evil. If you're gonna insist that way, I can't even blame them. Your gotta understand the mechanisms.
  
  I understand the mechanisms perfectly well, you're just arguing that lighter transphobia and homophobia should be acceptable and shouldn't be demonized. Transphobia and homophobia should be demonized.
  
  Homophobia is people having a problem with how you have fun. You and Nexus mods have a problem with how some other people are having fun. Look in the mirror. They aren't making you play their version. They're just offering it where others might have a chance to find it. It's exactly the same. Why should I tolerate your intolerance?.
  Do you wanna do away with straight porn?
- But you're the one who brought in assigned labels to begin with?
  That's why we can't "just sit here and argue", because you'd eventually end up arguing against yourself. Thanks for cutting out the rest of the loop the "but my free speech" people would normally need to be guided through before the conclusion was reached.
  
  No I didn't. If so, just point.
- Weirdly, most people I hear about being "censored" are able to tell everyone in the world how censored they are.

409 comments