‘I am not made for war’: the men fleeing Ukraine to evade conscription
‘I am not made for war’: the men fleeing Ukraine to evade conscription
As a new recruitment drive looms, some are turning to online handlers and forgers to escape the horror of war
cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/17423369
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Such a tough and heartbreaking situation. Of course I'm pretty sure most of us would like to think we'd step up if our country was brutally attacked but I honestly have no idea what I'd do. Facing seemingly endless meat waves would be hell by itself let alone thermobaric bombs and drones.
No fucking way. I ain't gonna' die fighting for the inflated egos, of the morons in charge of the world powers and their ass-lickers. I'd gather up my loved ones and leave in a heartbeat, if my country started forced conscription. I'm not enough of a nationalist to die "for king and fatherland", no matter how much i like this little country.
You don't have to be patriotic to end up stepping up. When you see the shit Russia did to the Ukrainians in the areas they annex in 2014, it's easy to see why people wouldn't want that to happen to their family, and why they'd be willing to step up.
There have been times in my life when I would have fled, and times in my life when I would have fought. Never for the idea of country, but certainly for the people in the country. I’m a middle aged American woman and having no family anymore, I have considered fighting for the families of Ukraine. Though not too seriously and I don’t even know if they’d take me
I'm not fighting for this shithole country unless I am fighting against MAGAs instead of for MAGAs.
I personally think that's the only likely scenario where there'd be war on American soil.
Fuck my country. My loyalty is to my family.
(Completely different country here, no present risk.) The unfortunate reality for me is that I have three kids who might be called up if the shit hits the fan, and I've had 30 odd years longer on this planet.
If its not me, it's my kids.
I'm too old and too sick to ever be called up to fight unless it's hopeless. But I have a 14-year-old daughter and I see no reason for the modern U.S. military to keep its "women can't be drafted" policy in such a situation. I can't lose her. My biggest fear, one I have nightmares about, is outliving her. Even if I was super patriotic, I don't think I'd risk her being forced to fight. I would flee.
Maybe so, and this may be callous of me, but I would not sacrifice my daughter over them. I don't know whether or not you are a parent, but I don't think many parents would be willing to sacrifice their children because others wanted them sacrificed.
How many other sons and daughters are worth your's? Ten? A hundred? A thousand? Does it matter if they're children, or legal adults? Does it matter if they die quickly, or held, raped for a month, and then tortured to death?
Are you a parent? Because otherwise, I don't think you really understand why I feel this way.
Do you lack empathy for other parents and other children? Do you expect them to die to save you and your's, or will you just expect enough of them to die to stall for the duration of your lifetimes? How direct does your contribution to the deaths of others have to be? If your daughter was held hostage, would you go to the camps every day and pull the lever on the gas chambers, or would that be 'too much'?
My mother loves me, and I know she'd die to save my dumb ass. She'd kill a few people at the least too. But I also know she would be deeply ashamed of me if I was bound by common morality to assist in the prevention of a great evil, and chose instead to flee - not just spur of the moment, but continually, every day of my life, until either the evil was successful in its genocide or until other people paid the price on my behalf.
Could you look your daughter in the eyes, and tell her a hundred children raped to death were the price to not risk her life? Not even a guaranteed trade, just not to risk her life? What other risks to her life are unacceptable?
I'll take that as a no.
The need to protect your offspring doesn't just transcend species, it transcends kingdoms.
There are trees that will protect their offspring.
I'm sorry, but trying to reason or shame me into abandoning my parental need to protect my offspring that goes back literally billions of years is not something you're going to be able to do. There is a long, long history of parents begging their children not to go to war.
The need to protect your offspring doesn’t just transcend species, it transcends kingdoms.
Cool, the need to reproduce also transcends kingdoms, but I wouldn't be making moral arguments for reproducing at any cost either.
I’m sorry, but trying to reason or shame me into abandoning my parental need to protect my offspring that goes back literally billions of years is not something you’re going to be able to do. There is a long, long history of parents begging their children not to go to war.
There's also a long, long history of parents shaming or even killing their own children for not going to war for a just cause. This idea of a child being worth committing any evil to save is very modern. You can claim that it's something that you could never fight, that it's some biological imperative that takes precedence over everything else, but history, and fuck, recent examples for that matter, very clearly points to that being nothing but an excuse.
Fight someone else's war...? And risk my life??. Fuck fighting for 'my country' - or some prick who might be in charge of it today. Its a fucking parasite that squeezed me for everything it could get, and relentlessly continues.