News @lemmy.world Lee Duna @lemmy.nz 12 mo. ago

Ukraine could lose the war if the U.S. delays military aid, top Ukrainian official says

www.nbcnews.com Ukraine could lose the war if the U.S. delays military aid, top Ukrainian official says

The Biden administration has asked Congress for more than $105 billion for Ukraine, Israel and U.S. border security, but so far Republicans in the House have said no.

52 comments

That’s the republicans plan.
- Putin's plan, the Republicans are just following orders.
  
  Nah, the republicans have just as much agency as Putin. These fuckers are fascists and fascists love to give aid to other fascists ever since Hitler helped Franco win Spain.
  
  You said the quiet part out loud.
The EU should never let this happen. Europeans love to shit on the US on how much we spend on the military and simultaneously form a queue to get on knees for sucking uncle sam dry when they need defences. Help your neighbors you leeches or fuck off. Dont put this on the US.
- The European spendings and commitments for Ukraine are higher than US. As it should be.
  
  Here is the tracker: https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-against-ukraine/ukraine-support-tracker/
  
  Good thing this post is how the war can be lost if the US delays funds and not EU.
  
  They need soldiers not money. And europe is FULL of deranged people who would get there at first sight.
  
  Ukraine just needs to let them come.
- For years the consensus was that the Europeans would accept US hegemony in exchange for protection. But that's no longer the case. But tell me, what exactly will the US gain from having a more assertive and militarised Europe?
  
  It makes SO MUCH sense for the US to spend money here. We spent 5% of our military budget for Ukraine to take out around half of Russia's army. So 5% to kneecap our biggest adversary is too expensive for the Republicans? Conservatives are a fucking cancer.
  
  Room to cut military spending on providing Europe's military defense for it?
  
  consensus was that EU would accept US hegemony in exchange for protection
  
  Yeah i dont think this was ever true. Even if it was true, why shit on your protection and crying when you need it? The US would gain not having to spend so much on military outposts in the EU/NATO if you guys stopped relying on the US for protection. Increase the taxes on your citizens a bit more to get the military spending you need. This way, the US can finally get some proper healthcare. Everyone wins, right?
- https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-against-ukraine/ukraine-support-tracker/
Be me, Putin

Man, Fuck NATO, I want a buffer zone between us and them

Idea.gif

I'll just annex some territory and make it a buffer state.

Oh shit, now NATO is closer than ever!

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What to do?

Idea.gif

I'll just annex some territory and make it a buffer state
- Nah, just buy some politicians of your biggest adversary and you're golden. They're cheap. Really cheap.
Look I'm all for being in this to win it. But we can't be the only ones helping.
- you're not
  
  Edit: Norway has given 1.6% of gheir GDP in aid, US, 0.3%. So, Norway has given 6-7 times more per capita (as they have a larger gdp per capita). The US is actually way down the list in aid per capita.
  
  Nice, then they shouldn't automatically lose if the US can't get its shit together.
And the US will lose its allies in the EU for now and into the future.
- Really I wouldn't say so. We are literally packed with US military bases all around Europe "just in case".
Do you know how apathetic I feel when my country gives hundreds of billions to fight this war and most of the people I know can’t afford to live? We work harder than ever, are as productive as ever, get so few days off, only to pay for bombs landing in countries we can’t even pick out on a map.

I want Ukraine to win. I want it badly. Ukraine will ask for more and more money so long as there is war. They will get it. Please don’t delay. So will genocidal Israel. And I will be living with my parents until I’m 30. Uncertain if I can afford healthcare.

I know who to be mad at and I want to feel good supporting just wars. But I go to pay my bills, I stand in line at the grocery store, I turn the heat off in my house, and all I hear are the bombs.
- We are not "giving" hundreds of billions of dollars to Ukraine.
  
  We are giving them mothballed weapons that are going to rot in a wearhouse somewhere, then replacing them with new weapons that are manufactured right here in the US and that industry whether you like it or not employs thousands of american workers.
  
  Its important that this fight is won by Ukraine because:
  
  A) a win by Russia and they control a MAJOR food producer and can affect food prices on a whim.
  
  B) the US letting it happen proves we won't stick by any ally and our word is useless. Good luck finding help in a major war.
  
  C) the US walking away gives a green light to China to invade Taiwan. Making them the sole producer of high-end computer chips.
  
  There is so much at stake with this war. it's not even funny.
  
  My concern is that we can give Ukraine millions of dollars of small arms, artillery, aging tanks etc. but they still need capable personnel to effectively employ it. From what I have seen it seems they were already scraping the bottom of the barrel and pressing older and older men into service via conscription. We know the Russians aren't concerned about how many bodies they throw at the conflict because they have supplemented their own forces with convicts, political dissidents, and poor conscripts.
  
  Like I said, I want them to win. It’s important they win. For all of the reasons you gave. All I’m saying is that it gets harder and harder to support and hope for others when I feel like my family is drowning and I know that my neighbors are too. I know a lot of it is weapons funding, some of it isn’t. I wish we treated the people at home as importantly as we do world conflicts, that’s all I’m saying. Does no one else feel that apathy?
- People like you always amaze me. Do you think if we didn't spend billions of dollars for this war then it would be used to help peo0le who can't afford to live? To Republicans, that's worse than aid to Ukraine.
  
  Friend, I support Ukraine and the aid they’re getting. I don’t support republicans and never will. And I won’t do their work for them here. I don’t know how this got lost and turned into such a political thing, I was just expressing that our money for war is near endless and yet we have unaffordable housing. I want to fund Ukraine AND I want people around me taken care of. All I was pointing out is apathy and I know I’m not alone in that.
- The same people who are making your life miserable also support the guys who start those wars.
  
  I told you, I know who to be mad at.
- Just like with Israel, the US "gives monetary aid" on the proviso that Ukraine turn around and hand it straight back in exchange for military supplies from US companies. Let's not pretend like the US and its defense industry isn't making out like bandits in this conflict and achieving the most cost effective US foreign policy intervention on Russia to date.
Well it was always a US war with Ukrainian bodies, right? I don't see how it was anything else. Ukrainian boots on the ground, USA money, right?

edit: but yeah, fuck Putin fuck Russia. Eat shit, you Russian dogs. You hate me I hate you, it's OK like that.

edit: I hate russians so so much, ruski sucks. Hate. So much Hate.
- Was the American revolution any less America’s fight just because the French were paying for it?
  
  Brother, I'm down for funding the Ukranian fight 100%. Fuck Putin, Fuck Russia
*The United States ~~Ukraine~~ could lose the war if the U.S. delays military aid, top Ukrainian official says
- TIL the United States shares a border with Russia.
  
  I mean almost, but you aren't exactly going to be invading across there.
  
  Permanently Deleted
- Look at a map of countries that are part of NATO in Europe
  
  Russia is not going to stop at Ukraine:
  
  Next country will be a NATO country.
  
  When that happens, that country will invoke Article 5
  
  Next step WW3
  
  Wouldn't Moldova be a likely next candidate?
  
  Moldova is ready to blow up their own airstrip they are worried it'd be used against them.
Ukraine was always going to lose. A few choice groups have been getting their pockets lined with cash in the mean time.
- What does Ukraine "losing" mean to you at this point of the war?
  
  What does Ukraine "winning" mean to you at this point in the war? When you're targeted by a much larger nation state that has every tactical advantage against you, you're going to lose.
  
  Look at every nation the United States has invaded over the last 60 years. Would you say any of them won? When hundreds of thousands of your people die violent deaths, it's hard to declare victory. Even if you remain independent, you lose.
- Nope. Germany alone can easily make up for the lack of US support, let alone Germany, France and the UK together. They won't like it and the US will suffer a huge decline in global power-projection capacity, but they'll do it --along with the rest of the EU save Hungary-- because they understand --in a way that many Americans can't-- that Putin cannot be allowed to win.
  
  The other point to make, one that I think is not widely appreciated in the US, is that the Ukrainians will never stop fighting, even if only in the form of a guerrilla insurgency.

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