Pre-emptive Threads defederation

my take on it is that i am completely against any kind of bridging between the platforms. i do think the fediverse in general is in danger, by being a victim of the "Embrace, Extend, Extinguish" strategy

as many on lemmy, i use this platform because of its decentralized, open-source, not-for-profit nature, and think the whole fediverse community would be in jeopardy if we don't act

I’m in favour of anything that prevents Meta’s enshittification of everything.

Facebook should be quarantined as much as possible.

I'm for the preemptive de-federation.

Yep. Defederate.

I have no interest in welcoming Facebook/Meta/Zuckerburg's Big Goddamn Fucky Wucky Company to the Fediverse. I would vote to defederate from Threads and any instance federated with them.

If and when Meta becomes “federated”, I 100% will be on team DEFEDERATE.

I'm taking off my admin hat and commenting as a user...

One minor correction to OP's post: Threads is a X/Twitter clone, not a Reddit clone.

I'm in the wait-and-see camp. If Threads someday links to Lemmy, and if it becomes problematic for the function or culture of the platform, then I will be in favor of cutting them off.
As @ryathal@sh.itjust.works mentioned, the real risk is that Meta starts steering Lemmy development in its favor. I don't foresee that happening given that dessalines and nutomic oversee code contributions, and they certainly won't allow it.

As an aside, I'm not convinced Threads will last long to begin with. It isn't looking like the X killer that Meta seemed to be hoping for. Meta has been trying to artificially drive engagement by creating shadow accounts for Facebook/Instagram users, and sticking Threads posts in people's Facebook feeds. Integrating with Mastodon feels like a further attempt to entice Meta users to adopt a microblogging app that nobody asked for. At this rate it may fizzle and die before they ever get around to interacting with Lemmy.

Defederate pls

Wait and see. As much as I hate Meta, i don't think we have much to gain by being a walled garden. Maybe we have also much to lose if we federate, who knows. I would not complain much if we defederate. If we do federate, there should be a zero-tolerance policy. If Meta tries some bullshit, or if there's the slightest doubt, we should defederate immediately.

For those out of the loop, Mark Zuckerberg recently made an announcement on Threads

I can't bring myself to care whether or not someone using a Facebook app can get a shit post in their feed.

Serious question - I’m not up to speed on what kind of effort goes into defederating/refederating. If it’s easy, then is “wait and see” an option?

Alternatively, is preemptively defederating now and refederating later if we want also an option?

If both options are on the table, I say wait and see just because it’s unexplored territory though I agree that it probably won’t be great. If it’s a big pain in the ass to change our stance, also wait and see; that way we only have to do the PITA thing once.

Federate, let them get a taste of sweet Lemmy content, then cut them off. Will make the Threads experience feel broken for native Threads users.

I don't get the point of pre-emptively de-federating. This would allow lemmy to have a wider reach amongst a general audience rather than be a niche community. We should only defederate after seeing if it's a problem or not to be federated with them.

I was just checking this point before registering here, and this instance pleases me :)

Defederate

I think there should be some instances that at least try federating with Threads just to see how it goes, but I don't want it to be this instance. The existence of voting in the Agora alone is a reason not to want a massive influx of new users from Instagram. This instance is uniquely vulnerable to the threat Threads may pose.

Don't defederate immediately, but do it automatically three months after threads goes live if users don't explicitly vote to keep it around. I wouldn't mind seeing how it goes at first.

Stay federated and if it's annoying, then defederate.

As much as I hate Meta/Facebook, we need activity and content to keep Lemmy alive, and Meta can potentially help provide that. If after federation, it turns out to be overwhelmingly toxic or the users provide no value at all, then defederate. If nothing else, doing it later will encourage Meta users to try other insrances.

The fun option would be to flood threads with shitposts and make them defederate from us when they start to lose advertisers

Please defederate from threads.

It kinda defeats the entire point of the fediverse. It couldn't be more obvious what they want to do, and that's control it, or destroy it.

Cut the thread.

Defederate.

What do you see as the risks to the larger fediverse in having Meta federated?

What benefit does Meta hope to see?

Nay, not worse than some instances already in lemmy and exposure is two way, but looking at the results, it seems I’ll have to create an alt on some other instance if I want to participate with the bigger communities of Threads.

It’s funny that shit like this gets automatic defederation and not the way some admins behave, make bullshit up, and leave links up to instances they claim have pedo content instead of reporting it to the competent authorities. Just like Musk, they make Zuckerberg actually look good in the shit comparison. But people only want to see what they want to see, specially when it involves someone who puts on a very different face when they interact with them.

Defederate

I don't plan on staying here if you defederate with Threads, but I respect your right to do it. The move seems unnecessarily reactionary and premature. I think the open web has more to gain from encouraging companies to invest in ActivityPub than it does siloing itself off from anyone who represents real growth in the space.

If you want the community to remain small, fair enough. I believe in a world in which every social media service is using ActivityPub; I don't care what or who they are. I don't even really understand what the anti-EEE crowd is afraid of? The protocol is run by a neutral party (W3C), I can't imagine any features that would compel major change, nobody that's already on the Fediverse is going to leave, you can always decide later to defederate... The system already seems pretty well protected against hostile action.

Defederate

Nothing.

My concerns have mostly been voiced already. EEE is a very valid strat used by larger companies. Additionally, I am super concerned that integrating will cause a flood effect and drown out and replace the existing communities. Just look at what happend with Reddit's purge for a good example, while I wasn't here prior, everyone I've chatted with who was has stated it annihilated a lot of the existing ideology that existed prior to the exodus.

I was thinking about this some more, and now I think this entire conversation and vote is entirely irrelevant. Not just not worth having, but actually completely makes no difference.

A big company like Meta is gonna want to control what content is on it. Which means they're almost certainly not going to use a blacklist model, they're going to use a whitelist. This allows them to carefully control who they're federated with.

Their federation list will likely be a who's who of big influential mastodon servers, maybe some pixelfed servers. They probably don't even know that Lemmy exists, let alone the 8th largest instance. If/when they realize Lemmy is a thing in a few years, they might approach lemmy.world and/or lemm.ee.

All of this to say, I don't think this vote matters.

Disclaimer: I know it’s an unpopular opinion, but despise what I said in my message, I am not strongly for or against federation with Threads. I just feel it’s better to give another point of view to the situation (there is no harm, people who disagree with this instance final decision will just migrate somewhere else, regardless of the choice).

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I don’t think we should treat Threads differently than any other instance. If they cause no harm, they should be allowed. As a consequence, I would personally not defederate immediately.

I am more concerned at a more general level, in the sense that federating with a large instance can be difficult / impossible to handle moderation-wise (which is not specific to Threads). This could be solved by simply putting the charge on Meta (just like any instance): if they can’t moderate their content, we will defederate (and revise the decision if changes are made on their side).

I also don’t really see why this would hurt the fediverse: it’s not like they can’t already get all the data they want from the fediverse, and the moment they will push ads to the fediverse, the instances will just defederate.

People will just follow the content they seek. If they have to migrate towards another instance federating with Threads (or directly leave for Threads), they will (which might not be an issue for the fediverse).

If you are hosting another instance, and have not had a vote, do it before the Threads bots vote for everyone.

Just like every other time these things have been posted, I wholly oppose defederation.