The state of US political discourse

Im voting for Joseph ROBINETTE Biden because I have been assured he is the ONLY ONE who can SAVE US from TRUMP. I'm not going to be helping trump by voting for anyone else

So who are you voting for actually?
- Im voting for Joseph ROBINETTE Biden because I have been assured he is the ONLY ONE who can SAVE US from TRUMP. I'm not going to be helping trump by voting for anyone else
  
  So like do you want to have an actual conversation or nah? You guys spend all your time talking about how communism is so genius and then I talk to people who are voting for "Joseph ROBINETTE Biden".
  Who are you actually voting for?
  
  Im voting for Joseph ROBINETTE Biden because I have been assured he is the ONLY ONE who can SAVE US from TRUMP. I'm not going to be helping trump by voting for anyone else
  idk how else to say it buddy, the message has been received loud and clear. Anything other than full throated, vocal support of J.R. Biden is actually support for Trump. I'm not going to be tricked into voting for Trump by considering any other candidate (as, again, I have been assured ad infinitum by numerous Educated and Serious liberals that anything OTHER than a vote for Biden is, actually, a vote for Trump)
  
  communism is so genius
  p.s. actually I would argue that it is a prerequisite for actual, real democracy to exist. Speaking of genius... who's that? Why, if it isn't Albert Einstein!
  Private capital tends to become concentrated in few hands, partly because of competition among the capitalists, and partly because technological development and the increasing division of labor encourage the formation of larger units of production at the expense of smaller ones. The result of these developments is an oligarchy of private capital the enormous power of which cannot be effectively checked even by a democratically organized political society. This is true since the members of legislative bodies are selected by political parties, largely financed or otherwise influenced by private capitalists who, for all practical purposes, separate the electorate from the legislature. The consequence is that the representatives of the people do not in fact sufficiently protect the interests of the underprivileged sections of the population. Moreover, under existing conditions, private capitalists inevitably control, directly or indirectly, the main sources of information (press, radio, education). It is thus extremely difficult, and indeed in most cases quite impossible, for the individual citizen to come to objective conclusions and to make intelligent use of his political rights.
  Albert Einstein, Why Socialism?
  Huh, wow, sounds to me like capitalism is an inherently authoritarian, anti-democratic system, by virtue of ownership of capital affording the capitalist class an inordinate amount of economic and political influence (as the major funders of political parties)
  but idk I guess we should just go and vote in sham election propping up liberal bourgeois democracy despite the numerous indicators of its grievous failures everywhere, because that is Genius (tm)
  
  but idk I guess we should just go and vote in sham election propping up liberal bourgeois democracy despite the numerous indicators of its grievous failures everywhere, because that is Genius ™
  "I will fix the system by not participating in it."
  Bold plan, good luck with that.
  
  good luck with doing the same thing that hasn't worked! real brain shit
  
  And what are you doing? Genuinely, you have not offered a single thing in this thread. What is your alternative plan? If you have nothing to offer then sit down.
  
  Genuinely, you have not offered a single thing in this thread
  have you? eat my dick balls and ass you dumb motherfucker
  
  eat my dick balls and ass you dumb motherfucker
  So is that the enlightened communist advice I've been waiting for or...?
  Anyways you're right, I haven't offered anything yet, so here's the advice:
  Vote for who you want to, and don't whine when one of the two major parties wins.
  
  “I will fix the system by not participating in it.”
  Bold plan, good luck with that.
  "Sure the controller is unplugged, but I can still beat the game"
  Good luck with that

Not a vote for Biden??? That's a vote for Trump sweaty

It's HER turn!
- Jill Biden could still run!
  
  Who are you voting for?
  
  Im voting for Joseph ROBINETTE Biden because I have been assured he is the ONLY ONE who can SAVE US from TRUMP. I'm not going to be helping trump by voting for anyone else
- If you aren't still in line to
  for her, its a vote for Trump
- Who are you voting for?
  
  My state hasn't approved De la Cruz for the ballot, I could write her in. I'm not sure how busy I'll be that day though so it's hard to predict what I'll have time for.
  
  As a fellow nonbinary person, I'm disappointed you're willing to step aside and let fascists strip away rights of LGBTQIA minorities.
  I hope that De la Cruz vote works out for you.
  
  As a fellow nonbinary person, I'm disappointed you're willing to step aside and let fascists strip away rights of LGBTQIA minorities.
  you mean the ones which have been eroded significantly with Biden in the white house?? huh, wow, let me think about that for half a second.....
  I hope that De la Cruz vote works out for you.
  hope voting for Hindenburg works out for you, Weimar German Liberal!
  
  Also why do you think I'm stepping aside and letting the fascists hurt minorities? You said nothing to substantiate that. You just said I was doing that. Care to explain?
  
  I won't, because you know why I said it.
  Go to a local queer munch and share these ideas with your fellow minorities, interested to hear your results.
  Meanwhile I'm voting for the party that doesn't want me dead.
  Good luck with that De la Cruz vote, I'm actually laughing super hard at that one, it's very clever.
  
  PSL also does not want you dead. I'm confused, I thought you wanted dialogue. I'm genuinely not sure what you mean. You can not believe me if you want but you haven't given any reason for what you're claiming.
  
  Alright then we can continue this new thread.
  Does the PSL have any chance of winning this year's election?
  Heck I didn't know De la Cruz was running in that party.
  EDIT: Apparently I was thinking of the De La Cruz people and Google have heard of (Elly, the baseball player), instead of Claudia De La Cruz, the socialist candidate I've never heard of in my life. I'm sure between now and November she'll figure out a way to clinch it.
  
  They can win if you vote for them. I don't know how everybody is going to vote.
  If we assume polling is an accurate indicator then depending on the state you live in voting at all is pointless because only one party will win.
  Were you stepping aside and letting the fascists strip minority rights in 2020? Because they appear to be doing that currently, and presumably you voted for Joe who is president while that is happening.
  
  The majority of hexbears are queer... we're just substantially more politically educated than shitlib queers like you.
  
  we're just substantially more politically educated than shitlib queers like you.
  I don't doubt that but your people skills are lacking if you change people's minds by calling them "shitlibs" and telling them you're substantially more educated than they are.
  A lot of people on these boards with your ideology but the 4chan baby talk and meme spam makes it hard to take you seriously.
  
  Sorry, but I'm not going to be polite to assholes who try to claim the moral high-ground by repeatedly telling my comrades they don't care about minorities because they refuse to support the genocide of other minorities.
  Why would I operate under the assumption that you're acting in good faith when you essentially tell us
  "oh, you're refusing to vote for a person who actively is making the world a worse place for minorities? You must hate minorities."
  You are a shitlib. And you will remain one until you self-crit and dismantle your current way of thinking. When that day happens, we'll welcome you as a comrade. But for now, you are not someone I can take seriously.
  
  I don't doubt that but your people skills are lacking if you change people's minds by calling them "shitlibs" and telling them you're substantially more educated than they are.
  Nobody is trying to change your mind. Why do liberals have such a hard time understanding when they're being made fun of? Nobody thinks your opinion is worth arguing against, changing one liberal's mind is useless even if you were willing to change your mind and you know that you're not. Nobody's dignifying you with real answers because you're a clown beneath contempt who's just parroting the same dogshit every blue media source pumps out, you're not saying anything we haven't all heard a dozen times a day. So you're joke to be made fun of and nothing more.
  
  What is your line, what would Kamala have to do or promise for you not to vote for her?
  For me it's promise to keep committing a genocide.
  
  For me , it's promise to step aside and let Trump commit the genocide instead.
  
  So nothing? All people are obligated to vote for democrats no matter what they promise to do? You would only not vote for her if she stopped running?
  
  let Trump commit the genocide instead.
  This is what it boils down to for you amoral liberals - you want the blue team to do the genocide and you'll only not vote for the blue team if they're going to let the red team do the genocide.
  
  Goofball take but alright.
  
  🌽
  
  If you're trans and not a communist you need to spend more time engaging with your fellow queers who are poor and working class. And read more Marx.
This is why nobody takes Hexbear seriously.
- the past hundred years of electoral politics really beg for the concept to be taken seriously, imagine voting in the most important election of your lifetime every 2-4 years for your entire life only to watch things get progressively worse anyway even when the "good" guys win, because even their best and wildest pipe dream policies if enacted amounted to about jack and shit
  can't wait for the hope and joy Harris/Walz administration to finally forgive student loan debt for a small subset of borrowers who open and run a business in a disadvantaged community for 3 years! can you imagine being one of the three dozen people that amazing legislation would help??
  oh, wait, I'm sorry, the parliamentarian is probably going to tell them 'no you can't do that' again and we will just have to grin and bear it, for the sake of civility
  
  I take the concept seriously, but not you clowns.
  If you cared about leftism as much as you cared about proper communication maybe people would listen to what you have to say.
  But unfortunately you spam memes and reaction images instead of having a proper discussion and everybody tunes you out.
  
  When a head and a book collide, is it always the book that's hollow?
  
  The quote you're looking for is:
  When a book and a head collide and a hollow sound is heard, must it always have come from the book?
  ― Georg Christoph Lichtenberg
  
  https://googlethatforyou.com?q=paraphrase
  
  Thanks, I now understand that they were paraphrasing instead of incorrectly remembering the quote.
  
  blublhulbuhlulbl muh civility
  eat me, liberal
  
  So genuinely, do you think you've changed anyone's mind today? If not, why are you wasting this energy?
  
  So genuinely, do you think you've changed anyone's mind today? If not, why are you wasting this energy?
  why are you wasting your energy legitimizing a bourgeois government that does almost quite literally nothing for you when you could also choose to 1) not waste your fucking time and 2) radicalize others against this absolutely horrendous system?
  you dumb motherfuckers are going to go all in on HARRIS WALZ HOPE AND JOY and shit because you're incapable of learning from previous mistakes. It's wild how this shit just happens over and over and over and over again and you stupid motherfuckers just keep playing along. Like absolutely wild how brainless you all are.
  I'm just going to sit back and watch China continue to eclipse the entirety of western civilization at an exponential rate every year, unless you rabid, bloodthirsty pieces of shit condone nuclear war against them first
  
  If you want to vote for someone who supports genocide, you do you pal. Maybe someday you'll realize that democracy in America is a sham and voting doesn't matter. But that requires doing the bare minimum amount of your own research, which you seem to be vehemently opposed to.
  I recommend reading Noam Chomsky's manufacturing consent. Once you understand how you're manipulated by the government and media, then you may be ready for some communist theory.
  
  *Michael Parenti's "Inventing Reality"
  
  Added to the list
  
  If you want to vote for someone who supports genocide, you do you pal.
  Who are you voting for?
  
  For someone who doesn't support genocide
  
  So genuinely, do you think you've changed anyone's mind today? If not, why are you wasting this energy?
  oh no all my energy, all my vital essence, it's fled me because I've trolled some shit-lib who, despite literally decades of evidence to the contrary, is clinging to the hope of electoralism saving us despite witnessing its constant failures
  can't wait to argue with you in 4 years over the next issuance of red/blue fascism, because you're too fucking stupid to notice there's very little difference. "oh no the republicans want you dead" yeah and the neoliberals in the Democratic party don't give a shit if you are or not either.
  you'd think shit like Newsom going all in on clearing the homeless would clue you people in but jesus fucking christ you are ignorant as fuck, literally incapable of engaging with politics beyond what you saw on MSNBC today
- We aren't being serious. We're making fun of you
Anyways who are you voting for?
- I'm staying in the race!

I'm writing in Trump.

Ivanka trump.

It's HER turn

So who are you actually voting for?
- They just told you. Why do you struggle to believe there are people who give our electoral system the exact amount of respect it merits?

The PSL ticket

Not a single Grad or Hexbear user has given me a real answer

people saying voting isn't going to do shit: yeah I'm not going to tell you who I'm voting for

you: OMG

RUSSIANS!!!

What would a serious conversation look like to you?

It would look like one where people tell me who they're planning to vote for, for starters.
- They're either not voting, voting for Claudia de la Cruz, or writing in Biden/Hillary/Obama.
  Why does who they vote for matter?
  
  Why does who they vote for matter?
  Honestly I didn't think it did, but the fact that I can't get an answer makes me question it.
  So I kept asking and continued not getting answers.
  Anyways, who are you voting for?
  
  Claudia de la Cruz. She isn't complicit in genocide, which is a plus.
  
  Do you believe she will win?
  
  Nope. But I view increasing the votes for PSL to be worth my minimal effort.
  
  Not to mention rejecting the monoparty in a way that can't possibly be misread as apathy
  
  Honestly I didn’t think it did, but the fact that I can’t get an answer makes me question it.
  Then why did you start spamming it in the first place? Did you think you could troll hexbear? With a standard dem tactic?
  Talk about chauvinism.

I suspect a significant percentage of very vocal individuals in Lemmy politics threads can't even vote in US elections because they don't live here.

oh man here we go! anyone with politics you don't like must be a foreign (russian!!) bot!
i'm from north carolina you fuckass
- I more mean to imply there a ton of Europeans and Canadians on Lemmy. They seem to have a lot of strong opinions on US politics. I don't think you (or almost anyone else) are a Russian bot.
I technically live here because I'm in a secret Russian Posting Facility deep underneath a Midwestern mall, like in stranger things
I'm sure getting that feeling. They REALLY don't want you voting for Biden, but can't suggest an alternative voting option.
Weird. (Which also bugs them, for some reason.)
- You know what, you're right. I'm gonna vote for Biden too. It's HIS turn
- They REALLY don’t want you voting for Biden
  Don't worry about all these people bud. I'm doing my part and voting for Biden this November.
- Dude they don't have an alternative because US elections ARE NOT DEMOCRACY. Bernie sanders was the most popular politician in the US, was not elected president, M4A has majority approval across the country, has not happened, abortion is widely popular, it was overturned while the Democrats controlled house, Senate and White House. Stop acting like the fucking politics understanders when you fall the same Charlie brown routine every four fucking years.
- They REALLY don’t want you voting for Biden
  Bwahaha most politically aware liberal
  
  Brain fart. Yeah it's been a long year. To be fair it's only been a couple weeks since you guys have had to paste Kamala's face over Joe's in your old memes.
  
  What memes are you talking about? I don't waste time on election memes, I'm just here to repeat the
  "You're playing a video game without the controller plugged in" metaphor.