Consultation concernant la dé-fédération avec 2 instances similaires
Consultation concernant la dé-fédération avec 2 instances similaires
Bonjour à tous,
la semaine dernière, ainsi qu'une année précédemment, le sujet de la dé-fédération avec l'instance hexbear.net a été mis sur le tapis.
La raison avancée étant, majoritairement, la toxicité de leurs membres ainsi que l'idéologie douteuse défendue par l'instance en général.
Dans le dernier sujet en date, après avoir donné mon avis plutôt négatif quant à la demande, avis justifié par plusieurs points, notamment la non-présence de leurs membres et contenus sur notre instance ainsi que l'aspect purement pratique d'empêcher les utilisateurs de jlai.lu d'accéder aux contenus de cette instance.
Quelques utilisateurs d'hexbear ont décidé de venir sur ce thread pour un peu servir d'exemple à OP afin d'insulter, faire preuve de déni de génocide, de techniques rhétoriques bancales dignes de l'alt right playbook, et de troll de qualité assez médiocre.
J'en suis donc venu à me questionner en effet sur la balance bénéfice/risque de cette fédération, ce qui semble être aussi le cas de plusieurs utilisateurs locaux dans le thread après avoir assisté à ce débarquement.
Plusieurs utilisateurs de l'instance lemmygrad ont aussi participé, et j'ai un peu l'impression que ces deux instances sont très similaires, une plus transphobe que l'autre, mais c'est à peu près la seule différence que j'ai pu voir.
Une liste d'exemples de contenu "douteux" a été donné par une tierce personne, en plus d'exemples dans le thread en question.
J'ai donc décidé d'ouvrir ce sujet afin de prendre la température avec un vote, ainsi qu'avoir une discussion générale sur ce sujet, au cas où des raisons de rester fédérés existent qui ne me soient pas venues.
Ce sujet est ouvert à la fédération par design, pour que sa portée soit la plus large possible.
Les votes, eux, sont dans une communauté locale, et donc accessibles uniquement par les membres de l'instance.
Les votes sont publics par design (et un peu par facilité aussi).
Le vote concernant la fédération avec hexbear est disponible ici.
Le vote concernant la fédération avec lemmygrad est disponible ici.
Pour voter, rendez-vous sur les liens ci-dessus et votez + ou - selon votre avis.
Edit du 2024-11-03:
Hexbear ayant pré-emptivement dé-fédéré, le vote devient inutile et aucune action spécifique n'a besoin d'être faite de notre côté.
Le vote reste maintenu pour grad.
Edit 2:
Par transparence, soumerd_retardataire est ban pour brigading suite à son post de mauvaise foi sur grad qui me fait rentrer de week-end sur une modqueue pleine de trolls.
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I think the content on hexbear is interesting and it's bad to alienate new users of what they might find there. I reread the old post and the issues are being conflated in the comments here, I just don't see what is being described here. Sure the bickering gets harsh deep in the comments, but that's just the internet. People explain themselves sufficently well. That's it.
> but that’s just the internet.
No, that's the point, it's not "the internet", it's a violent culture that might or might not be ok for everyone. It doesn't have to be accepted just because it's there. That would be like saying "Sure slavery is bad, but that's just humans".
En français s'il vous plaît
Tu vas voir qu'il va ramener ses potos et on va avoir une seconde vague de haine qui va convaincre tout le monde 😂
Tout est possible 😄
C'est pour discuter honnêtement ou juste pour répéter qu'on lit la situation de façon opposé? J'ai pas trop envie, je voulais juste dire qu'on semble pas voir la même réalité. Les gens sont rapides à ignorer la vision de l'autre.
On peut discuter honnêtement.
Que penses-tu de
les Français méritent un millier de Charlie Hebdo ?
throwing a pipe bomb into an art contest incredibly good and based
Le cerveau germanique est prompt aux agressions sexuelles
J'ai hâte que le Sahel botte vos culs de Frouzes
Well i think we want a place to chill here and most of us use alt.
As Rakoo sumed it up, bickering is not okay. That's not a sane way to discuss about topic. In fact, those are the very tool to for domination over people.
Words do have a deep impact on mental health, it may end up into serious complication. Following the french law, we may end up in prison.
And the table detector, that logic doesn't alway work. For example, why would you want to sit on the same table with us ?
If you agree with this and want to help hexbear when you see bickering, insult...don't let them do as they please :
- Stand up, and ask OP why they have to use slur, call for violence to demonstrate their point.
- Ask OP to edit their post AND apologize.
- Ask help from your admin if it continue so.
You may want ask yourself why other decided that way and check what are the posts we disagree with. Maybe you won't understand it yet nor why, but you can read various threads, comment.
The whole mental health angle is reaching a bit far, but if anyone actually invokes it, I wouldn't fight back. Like sure, you don't want comment clashes, I can understand, I won't trigger them.
I just have a problem with considering the whole hexbear instance as toxic and ideologically dubious. I get why someone might feel like that, but seeing 5 top level comments repeating it when I just don't believe it's true, I felt like adding my grain of salt.
We sit at the same table to try and bring the left together. I don't care about helping Hexbear, I just wanna interest random users to challenge their views like I do. I have to work at standing up to others, true, but I haven't encountered slurs, calls to violence or troll behavior from Hexbear, at least none that haven't been resolved properly (though I'm sure it can happen).
Sometimes you express a view that's untrue or that lacks empathy and get called out for it. It feels insulting when it happens, but I doesn't have to be.
I may have chosen an extrem situation but there are plenty case were it happened. We should never take it lightly and ask other if they are fine.
I just have a problem with considering the whole hexbear instance as toxic and ideologically dubious
When it was pointed out in the post we asked for sources, proof outside his post. We disagreed with OP at first. We took into account that et would stir some anger. You needed to vent off. Okay.
However, Hexbear has a list of unmoderated post as the call for a remake of Charlie Hebdo, denial of Uygurs genocide...And there are case when people tried to point out what's wrong were banned. And repeated insult or denial.
I don’t care about helping Hexbear, I just wanna interest random users to challenge their views like I do
Well, you do want to help in some way and asking us giving them a chance and trying to prove otherwise by talking with us. I find that side of you kinda cute.
As for my own opinion, i just want a place to chill when i'm exhausted. I don't have the energy to spent the whole night on it nor giving you the wrong idea that i'm forgiving them. I prefer sharing picture on how comfy is my new bed, or science topic. :)
Sometimes you express a view that’s untrue or that lacks empathy and get called out for it. It feels insulting when it happens, but I doesn’t have to be.
Were you speaking generally or thinking about a peculiar comment/post ? 🤔
See ya and have a nice day. :)
Pour citer une explication profonde d'un de tes collègues :
"lol"
I'm not "my colleagues" and I don't speak for them. If replying a simple "lol" to something of substance feels wrong, you could avoid doing it. My experience there makes me believe the lol user must have responded to something useless or disconnected from reality.
Look, no one is saying you are like them and no community is representative of all of its people. But I can't understand why you would try and engage into defending their behavior. You pointing the "lol" used by @TheFrirish@jlai.lu and, at the same time, finding excuses and reasons for hexbear users doing so is an odd choice. Look, if I were to try and find an excuse, I would simply say that
the bickering gets harsh deep in the comments, but that's just the internet.
is disconnected from reality. No one would ever do IRL what hexbear users did here, or elsewhere for instance.