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8000-9000 dead combatants, 20,000 civilians. Hamas isn't even doing a good job of using human shields. One of the Lord's was before parliament yesterday putting the perspective of that ratio out there. Kudos to Israel for their hard work in protecting civilians in the Urban warfare they're engaged in was essentially the summary. 2:1 is apparently much better than the 6:1 typical of situations like this. Still too many people dying. The rockets need to stop ASAP.
Where does your 8000 number come from? So far we have not seen any credible claims of how many Combatants were killed.
We only know that 2/3 people killed by israel are women and children. Which means the civilian casualty ratio is likely far higher.
By the way the civilian casualty ratio on Oct7 was 2:1, even including all the civilians killed by the IDF. Do you praise Hamas?
Same place the 27000 comes from. Intelligence reporting from the region.
The 2/3rds women and children....how many of those children were fighters? You've gotta be really fucking stupid to accept that the under 18 crowd there isn't taking up arms, we've got hours of footage direct from Hamas and UNRWA proving otherwise.
That you're conflating the attack that started this war with the response, that you're comparing reservists pulled from their beds and taken hostage to the Palestinians using 5 year olds as human shields really does show your ignorance and bias here. If you think the rules of engagement should be those of 10/7, then so be it. Thankfully Israel holds itself to a higher standard than the likes of Hamas and yourself.
When it comes to human shields, the only independent verification back in 2014 (Amnesty link) is of Weapons (not rockets) hidden at a vacant school, situated btwn 2 UNRWA schools housing displaced people, by a Palestinian armed group.
The Guardian journalists had encountered a couple individuals in 2014 too.
HRW on Laws-of-War Violations 2009
Amnesty on Hamas War Crimes 2023
Yet none of those come remotely close to making hospitals and schools bombing targets. Even if all the IDF claims were true, that does not exempt those hospitals and schools as protected under international law.
While we're on the subject, let's look at how the IDF uses Human Shields including Children (2013 Report)
Oh FFS, you're not actually trying to claim they don't use human shields are you? Seriously? They fucking admit it lol.
The lengths you terrorist apologists go to is fucking comical.
there has been no evidence outside os Isn'treal backed souces saying the use human shields
I mean Hamas admits it. Multiple newspapers have published on it going back a decade.... this isn't news, but some have fallen for the revisionist history Iran is pumping out these days.
There has been no evidence of human sheilds outside of US and Isn'treal media. This is not "Iranian propoganda" Dispite your wishful thinking
Now answer my damn question why is the Isn'treal offense Force, attacking farms, schools hostpitals, water treatment plants, and areas they promised would be safe zones.
Why is Isn'treal banning food, water, desalinization and medicine entering.
LoL, how about we take Anti Semitic stereotypes for $1000 Alex, it's in the global media but Israel must be controlling that LoL. Lemme guess, you rely on Al Jazeera?
Why is Hamas setting up in civilian settings? There's your clear and obvious answer. You literally can't deny them doing it, they've admitted to it on television in Arabic LoL. The insanity here is comical.
Those aide convoys have routinely been verified as having banned cargo smuggled in them. Why is Hamas continuing to steal aid, and put Palestinians at risk with their actions? Why did Hamas use the water pipes to build bombs? Don't ya think that might make things toguher for Palestinians?
Why did Hamas steal the medicine for the hostages? They didn't even use it, they just stole it.
Seems pretty clear that the problem isn't the glorious democracy but the maniacal dictatorship. Good thing the very real idf is taking care of the problem. :*
No I have never watched Al Jazeera a day in my life I have issues with Qatar, and prefer npt to get my news from their mouth peice, I am also not saying "The Jews control the media" 1) because Isn'treal does not, has never, and will never represent Judeism, second because I understand material intrests,
Hamas is not intentionally using civilian settings, there has been no independent evidence to use this, all evedence of such has been assertions of the IOF, and Gaza is artifically overcrowded by systematic forces Isn'treal has done in a long running genocide, so when they fight back it will be closer than expected, BUT NOT A SHOOL OR HOSPITAL AND NOT EVERY SINGLE HOSPITAL IN GAZA
You see the problem with citing banned cargo is Isn'treal defines medicine food, water, or anything that can be used as such as banned cargo, so your claim is meaningless, also agian no evidence outside of Isn'treals say so
No evidence of them stealing medication l, but gpod attempt at a boogie man, why does the IOF shoot returning POWs?
And an admit to the genocide, thank you
why is Isn'treal bombing hospitals and schools. Why are they preventing food water and medicine from entering , why are they destroying water processing plants cemetaries farms and orchards.
When someone asks for a source, and then OP's reply does not have a link in it, I ignore everything OP says.
Do you have a source for those numbers?
From the AJ live tracker you can get that in Gaza 28,775 people have been killed, including more than: 12,300 children, and 8,400 women. 68,552 have been injured, including at least: 8,663 children and 6,327 women. With more than 7000 still missing. He's either assuming all the Men killed, ~8,075 are Hamas or that some of the 12,300 children killed were Hamas.
Instead of analyzing why violent resistance to apartheid has been happening since like 1988 and advocating for an end to the occupation, it seems he'd rather justify these deaths.
You're using Al Jazeera as your verified source? The same Media operation that's literally paid for by the same benefactor as Hamas? No bias there LMFAO.
Technically the Gaza Health Ministry, for good reason. And no lol, I don't exclusively use any news source. I always look for independent verification.
“Everyone uses the figures from the Gaza Health Ministry because those are generally proven to be reliable,” said Omar Shakir, Israel and Palestine director at Human Rights Watch. “In the times in which we have done our own verification of numbers for particular strikes, I’m not aware of any time which there’s been some major discrepancy.” -WaPo
Bias and credibility are two different things. Framing deaths as being killed by Israeli forces compared to simply dying has a difference of bias. On-the-ground reporting with independent verification compared to unsubstantiated claims is a difference of credibility
Technically.... they're The same thing. They serve the same Master.
"We would like to extend congratulations to Israel for only grinding up two orphans for every enemy combatant when they could be grinding up six orphans for every enemy combatant"
What a bullshit line of reasoning. I'm not blaming you, to be clear. I'm blaming the unwiped asshole who decided that spinning this into good news was the only positive thing they could say.
This is a weird comment. For months I've only heard about the indiscriminate killing and when someone who's an expert on how these things play out offers context and commentary compared to global events, you don't accept it.
Offering context does not make the decision to go scorched earth on a small, densely packed, and functionally trapped population any better.
Israel can stop whenever they want, and it will still take a decade at this point for whoever is left to rebuild. Just because they're "doing better than most" at slaughtering civilians doesn't mean it isn't abhorrent.
It feels a lot like the US congratulating themselves for ushering in democracy to a functionally destroyed Iraq.
It doesn't make what better? No one's excusing the loss of life, they're putting it into context by demonstrating that Israel is clearly not indiscriminately bombing the place.
Israel cannot stop, Hamas has made that exceptionally clear with their repeatedly saying they will continue to massacre the country and 10/7 was a rehearsal. No country would let that existential threat just sit on it's border firing thousands of rockets at it. That's just an outrageous claim to make, they can't stop until Hamas is gone. No country on this planet would.
So the UN is calling for a ceasefire that the US keeps vetoing for.. No reason?
Besides the Oct 7th invasion, what damage has Hamas done to Israel? The rockets that get shot from Gaza into Israel, from what I understand, unilaterally get shot down.
Netanyahu said just yesterday that he intends on thwarting any attempt to a demilitarized Palestine, which is pretty much the only compromise short of full invasion and control. Israel has essentially announced its intention to wipe out Hamas, which isn't itself a bad thing, except that they are dislocating 1m+ people in the process into other countries that don't want them, and killing people who don't or can't move.
Israel won't cooperate with probes into the way their military handles civilian encounters, so we're just supposed to believe them when they say "it's fine" when videos arise of them outright executing civilians?
The US vetoed it because it lacked the turnover of hostages from what I read. Seems like a great reason to shoot it down.
There are entire towns vacated because of rocket fire. There's been medical centers hit by fire South of Tel Aviv. Israel invested its money into defending its people, Hamas used its money to build tunnels civilians aren't allowed into and bombs.... you're pretty much saying not enough Israelis are dying so the bombing doesn't matter. That's pretty fucked up but sure. One side cares about their people, the other openly states it doesn't.
Netanyahu is a criminal, no argument there but he's entirely correct in saying Israel will have full control over the strip when this is done. That's the only option for Israeli safety. From there it should be transferred to a technocratic government hosted by the Arab states that have established ties with Israel, UAE and Saudi should lead that effort but that'll come after the current administration is replaced. Based on the people protesting, that's ASAP but not until Hamas is done.
Given the clear bias against Israel by the UN, the number of resolutions issued for human rights is comical, would you accept a probe? Iran sits on the human rights commission. Israel has been rung up for it's treatment of women LoL. That's a kangaroo court if there's ever been one. It's disappointing there isn't a reasonable body to investigate though, UNRWA needs to be dismantled and I'm quite sure there's monsters in the IDF that need to be locked up too. I'm hopeful their judiciary will hold their people to account, they've done it previously but I don't think it'll be enough. That's a sad reality of war. Just like the people pulling the strings in Doha and Tehran won't be held to account, there's going to be Israelis who aren't either.
There's no good guy in this conflict. No matter which way you look at it, this is not a defensive action by Israel.
you're pretty much saying not enough Israelis are dying so the bombing doesn't matter
What you're saying is that provisional and hypothetical safety of civilians that aren't evacuated is reason enough to stage an invasion with a blood price several hundred times higher.
Among other things, the biggest difference here is that Israeli civilians can be evacuated. Palestinians have nowhere to go. They are dying in their homes or dying at the border where they have nowhere to go.
the number of resolutions issued for human rights is comical
So you're insinuating that the number of human rights violations that Israel can be held liable for should be limited by some artificial volume considered "palatable" to some authority? Do you realize how ridiculous that is? If Israel is committing a comical number of human rights violations, they need to answer to a comical number of charges.
No, I'm saying that one country goes far out of its way to defend its people and the other does the exact opposite. That's not Israel's fault, they're taking precautions for Gazans that Gazans refuse to take for themselves.
Palestinians don't have many places to go and the ones they have are immediately turned into staging grounds for rocket attacks. Israel is going to return fire even if it's from an area they told people to seek refuge in. Would you expect them not to? Wanna know how this stops tomorrow? Release the hostages and lay down their arms, it's over. That's really how easy this can end. The Palestinians don't care though, they're soaking up western sympathy with the blood of their children and that's exactly their plan.
I'm not insinuating anything. I'm saying flat out that the UN has lost any semblance of reason on the Israel file and their record makes that abundantly clear. If there was an institution capable of investigating, I'd be all for it. The mopes who couldn't find Hamas when they were literally sharing the same electrical meter aren't the guys who can be trusted to investigate anything....who would you suggest investigate? Like I said, people who broke the law need to be held to account. I'm including the head of UNRWA in that.
they're taking precautions for Gazans that Gazans refuse to take for themselves.
This is laughable. Israelis were caught on video shooting refugees. At best they're doing no worse than Hamas. Neither side cares about the civilians. The whole 2:1 thing is a nice, tidy piece of propaganda designed to sugarcoat the fact that they are killing civilians
The Palestinians don't care though, they're soaking up western sympathy with the blood of their children and that's exactly their plan
Of all the bloviating you're doing, of all the Israeli propaganda you've pushed, this is the most egregious. You've no proof of this strategy, just like you have no proof of Israel's good intentions. You're just dehumanizing a population of about a million in order to justify eliminating them all over a fighting force of maybe a tenth of them.
Like I said, people who broke the law need to be held to account
No I get it. It's clear that your version of facing the law includes a blank check for genocide because "that's the reality of war".
Of all the points you've made, you don't seem to understand that a even a broken system with heavy bias against the aggressor is better than letting the aggressor do whatever they want to a population they have stated that they wish to eradicate.
Saying "the UN is a joke" is not a justification.
No the US Vetoed it because they are complicet in the Genocide, if you hear the president ever speak about Isn'treal it is clear that he will do everything in his power to suport them no matter what they do.
Also there is no bias aganst Isn'treal, there is a larger number of nations who dislike them because, and I cannot stress this enough, most nations, and all decent people dislike genocide... I am sorry you have to learn you are a bad person this way
LoL. That you can't even spell it properly while claiming there's no bias just demonstrates your ignorance bigotry. You can claim I'm not a good person, I'm fine with the judgments of the likes of you. History will again show just how easily the morons of society fall for the propaganda being pushed, and you're quite clearly one of the captured.
Oh I as a person, as the Red Army Dog 100% Bias, I hate genocide and Genociders l, I hate opression
The UN member nations, no there is no unfair or unjust hatred of Isn'treal, they, and I cannot stress this enough, are doing a GENOCIDE
why are they bombing hospitals, schools, water facilities, the areas they have told the palitinians are the save zones, buldozing cemetaries, and grenading families of those who request aid in leaving due to disabilities.
Palestinians bombed their own hospitals FFS. IDF is returning fire, the question should be why does Hamas continue to set up their operations amongst civilian infrastructure?
Except all independent reports found both of thouse statments to be untrue, only Isn'treal makes those claims, they also claim that palistinians are animals, odd that they woud use such genocidal language...
WTF are you talking about? Al Jazeera literally live streamed it LMFAO. there's no verified reports showing otherwise. If there are please send them over.
Odd they'd use the same language their enemies use? Not at all. If someone wants to pick a fight, they don't get to cry when you fight back.
Here you go a break down of proof otherwise ypu genocidal manach
Oh so now all people who use the same language are on the same side
Also share that message with Isn'treal when they started this with the Nakba
Even IDF skewed exaggeratd false numbers admited they kill 70% kids and women to 30% Men aka Hamas. Where did you get that 2:1 from? Do you feel better to make up things just to not face the reality that Israel is an aparthied state and genocidal terrorists who kill babies in incubators, cripple and amputate kids, bomb and shoot women little kids hiding in their houses and cars?
The ratio was presented by a Lord in Parliament yesterday. Didn't catch his name, he was some sort of historian. I'm sure you can find it in the record, it was in session. The absurdity of calling Israel an apartheid state when Arabs sit in Parliament, on the Courts and in political office, while the street signs are Arabic and Hebrew is utterly absurd. Do you know any Israeli Arabs? They've been among the loudest supporters of Zionism out there since October. That statement alone identifies you as an absolute joke.
I hate to break it to you but your 2:1 ratio, is off by a factor of 10. Israel being a genocidal aparthied state ruling by IJC, Unicef, UN and many. Also guess who are the loudest supporters for China "unification" with Taiwan? Yes Taiwanise people working for the CCP. Same for Russia and Ukraine, and 99 other examples around the word. Finally, the only joke here is calling Israel a democracy because it's actually objectively 100 times better to live under the worst dictatorships and murderous oppressive corrupt governments of the middle east than to a palestinians living in Israel
And some of the loudest detractors of the apartheid state of israel are jewish
Two Jews three opinions is a phrase that goes back to before Islam had been conceived. It's hardly surprising that there are Jews speaking out against themselves. What's more surprising is the overwhelming support for the state of Israel by the Palestinian Israeli population. I suppose they of all people understand how good they have it in Israel.
Interesting that you say "jews speaking out against themselves"
Those Jewish people about are speaking out against israel. The state of israel and Judaism are not the same thing, as much as zionists will try to convince you otherwise. Speaking against israel is not speaking against judaism or Jewish people as a whole.
And yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if there are Palestinians living in israel that are loudly declaring support for israel. They don't want to be hurt or killed, so they say what they think will keep them safe.
Although I couldn't find much info about that, do you have any source or more info?
The safety of Jews is absolutely directly tied to the existence of Israel, the state of Israel is directly linked to Judaism which is why Jews daily prayer starts with a call to Israel. It's why all Jewish holidays are based on the agricultural cycles of Israel. An anti Zionist Jew is absolutely working against their own interests.
That you think Arabs in Israel don't have the ability to speak out against the government demonstrates your ignorance here, they're in the streets by the thousands protesting weekly.
Muhammed zoabi is a good follow if you're interested in Arabs who support Israel while being critical of their government and policies. He is great at breaking down complex concepts although he's a bit out there at times.