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Im referring to the case of Shani Louk among others, go look up the videos if you can stomach it. Somehow I don't see this behaviour on IDF side, they also don't attack music festivals or take 4yo kids as hostages. Hamas has lost any credibility and certainly has no moral right to anything anymore. The case of settlements might be shitty but they are no justification for any of this.
look at the Nakba, or the consistant or ongoing and persistant genocide of the Palistinian people of Isn'treal that has been going on for decades none stop. There is no moral right on the side of Isn'treal, and there is no justification for their existence. Zionism, was considered Antisemetic for a long time and was linked to Nazism. During this phase of the genocide there have been endless reports of rapes of Palistinian women. If we want to talk about moral rights, the Genocidal Settler Colony, has no moral right to anything and predates hamas... speaking of, Hamas was not the first freedom fighting group, there was (and still is) the Popular front, they are far more left wing, but grew too popular for the liking of Isn;treal so they funded Hamas hoping to start infighting (there was not) the only thing that happened was it became a freedom fighting group closer to the overton window of Isn'treal.
I mean maybe the way Israel was set up was not correct but it's been a long time ago and it's time to let go. This is revisionist, just like Putin arguing how he wants the soviet union back or China vs. Taiwan. Israel is a fact for a long time now, there is no good way to change this now so maybe look forward and try for peaceful coexistance.
And yes the settlement policies and other things are bad, I'm not saying that everything Israel is doing is 100% good. But it's on an entirely different level and the ends don't always justify the means. If you try to fight this by being a babarian horde using human shield tactics and by parading dead girls with their tits out through the streets of Gaza then don't expect my support.
So let me get this 100% straight what you are saying... Isn'treal stole land, even after Palistine offored to start a new state combining the both of them, they did the Nakba... confined them to gettos, contenualy will launch attacks on them un provoked, kicked them out of their homes, prevent them from travel, puts Palistine on a strict calorie count as found by the UN to keep the palistinians hungry, routeenly denies them water, food and electricity, will routenly kill them, berate them, dehumanise them. Call them "animals" and "Beasts" but because Isn'treal started this genocide in the late 1940s so if we round to 1950 about 70 years ago, within living history, was "so long ago" the people, who might I add are STILL BEING GENOCIDED should just let it go, because without violance there is no way for them to end their opression and genoicde?
Your argument, just so I know 100% and I am not called someone who is straw manning later is that if a genocide is happening for long enough, and opression is happening for long enough, the opressed should just let it happen, and rocking the boat means violance, and might make others uncomfertable, so just let the genocide happen and try your best to live peacefully with, the people who have in the past genocided you, and are still genociding you?
Did I get your argument correct?
This is not at all what I said and you are making assumptions that are not true. Like Israel is attacking unprovoked just for the sake of it? That's bullshit. And Israel routinely kills random civilians out of cruelty? That's simply not true. Yes civilians sometimes end up as collateral damage but it is never the direct intention. The IDF has processes in place to determine when and where to attack and every single one is based on intel and reasonable probability that legit combatants and targets are hit. Are they always right? Of course not. Do they accept civilian casualties if that can't be avoided? Of course they do. That doesn't change the fact that civilians are not attacked unprovoked just like that out of cruelty or in order to genocide them.
The same can't be said about Hamas music festival attacks and that precisely is the difference.
agian Look up the Nakba, this has been a decades long genocide, nothing about what Hamas is doing is unprovoked, they are retalating aganst a DECADES LONG GENOCIDE
Sorry but even if we assume somehow all other ways are exhausted and violence is your last resort, going after the kids and the festivalgoers is never justified under any circumstances. Maybe if Hamas wouldve directed the fight at the people that have bit to do with the situation like police or army who also use violence to enforce shitty policies.
But with the way things are and the actions Hamas did I don't have to think twice, I'll side with Israel and IDF. They are not perfect but still the way way better option.
So you will side with the people comitting a genocide. Your actions words and beliefs speak loudly about your charicter. History will speak volumes as you have firmly planted yourself on the wrong side of it. I hope that John Brown's soul finds you and he does what he does best to the wicked, and to the oppressive forces, his soul goes marching on, and that should keep people the likes of you up at night.
You cannot look at what Isn'treal has done, the strick calolery count, the slow march in, and tell me that this was not on the horison. You cannot tell me that the palistinians had any other choice, when your options are 1) do nothing and die or 2) stand up and maybe not die, it is only right and just that you fight back. This is not shitty desisions this is a genocide, it started back with the Nakba, and they are contenuing it now. Just because Hamas is not being civil about it, or peacfully protesting means nothing. I hope you some day can out grow your silly little civility politics and relise what is happening. I also hope you never have to even immagine going through a genocide, as the palistinians have done.
That's quite a big and hefty "just because". And also shooting up a music festival is not "standing up to the fight", there was no fight there at all. And also there are plenty of other options. If you don't want to fight and risk your life, what about instead of going after the kids you just move elsewhere and maybe support the cause from exile, organizing opposition doing lobby work etc. I get that it is shitty to leave your place like this. But how is shooting up a music festival somehow the more reasonable option?