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If you took this out of the context of being on lemmy, it would be impossible to tell which side this came from.
What the fuck are you smoking?
Outside of shitty Israeli propaganda, no-one thinks Israel is under the threat of genocide.
And who think that Israel is committing one? The rest of the fucking world.
If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. If an elephant has its foot on the tail of a mouse and you say that you are neutral, the mouse will not appreciate your neutrality. We may be surprised at the people we find in heaven.
— Desmond Tutu
"What the fuck are you smoking" is an ad hominem designed to distract from my undeniably true point, specifically: that both sides are similar in using unfair allegations of defending genocide to dismiss more nuanced beliefs of the other side.
Outside of shitty Israeli propaganda, no-one thinks Israel is under the threat of genocide.
This is called a motte-and-bailey fallacy. You're taking my point implying that both sides accuse the other of defending genocide and then wanna say I'm suggesting Israel is under threat of genocide. These are different things. You use a different thing because if you were to address the actual point, which again is undeniably true, you would have a very hard time.
To be clear, the "genocide" Israel supporters (unfairly) accuse others of defending is the Hamas attack on Israel, where Hamas killed unarmed civilians at close range, proudly recording it on video. I don't mean to imply you can't figure that out on your own, but you kinda forced me to point it out.
And if you say "but people who are protesting Israel aren't defending Hamas attacking Israeli civilians, but are defending the right of the Palestinian civilians to remain alive", then you understand completely. Now try swapping the relevant ethno-religious tribes.
You don't understand what tbe words "ad hominem" or "genocide"
Mean.
You're a little kid larping a philosopher. Badly.
To be clear, the "genocide" Israel supporters (unfairly) accuse others of defending is the Hamas attack on Israel, where Hamas killed unarmed civilians at close range, proudly recording it on video
In a highly charged ruling in January, the court ordered Israel to do everything in its power to prevent genocidal acts in Gaza
Again, you don't seem to understand what "genocide" means.
It's not "both sides". "Both sides" do not have cases in the ICC about being accused of genocide. Both sides do not have convictions from the ICC that they need to do all the can to stop genocidal actions being undertaken.
You genocide defenders make me fucking sick. Grow some balls and question your brainwashing.
Ad hominem = attacking the person rather than the argument. Like "you're a little kid..." The fact that you feel the need to accuse someone you've never seen of being a kid instead of pointing out what's actually wrong with what I'm saying should be seen as evidence that you are desperately flailing, pathetically grasping for straws to build an argument from when you clearly have nothing. Instead, it's getting upvoted, for some reason.
Everything else you say is completely and absolutely non-responsive, internet tropes in place of argument. You completely ignore the whole point of my argument, which is that you replaced my argument with another argument and argued against that instead, and proceeded to argue against an argument that was never made in the exact way I described.
Forget Israel and Palestine, the fact that this illogical Trumpian debate tactic shit is getting upvoted is the new thing that disturbs me. We're truly fucked as a species.
Yes, "rather than". Do you know what those words mean?
It doesn't mean the same as "in addition to", does it?
"Everything else you say is completely..."
You are the one pulling an ad hominem, not me. You ignore my answer to your "argument" and go on to attack my person. Your entire argument is "without the context of the site we're on, no-one could know what this is referring to", as if this was some sort of "both sides" bullshit, which you claim to despise.
It's not. Everyone knows Israel is genociding Palestine and not a single reasonable person would argue that Palestine is trying to genocide Israel.
https://press.un.org/en/2024/ga12599.doc.htm
During the day-long discussion, speakers were near-unanimous in demanding an immediate ceasefire in Gaza and warning against the catastrophic consequences of Israel’s assault on Rafah, where more than 1.5 million have congregated. Many underscored that while the adopted resolution represents the first step towards fulfilling the international community’s obligations to Palestine, ensuring its full UN membership is imperative.
Israel's assault on Rafah.
Fuck your equivocating teenage propaganda bullshit.
You are the one pulling an ad hominem, not me. You ignore my answer to your “argument” and go on to attack my person.
No I didn't, everything was specific to your argument. I said nothing about you. As for your argument, well I guess I'm glad that I'm promoted to teenager now.
Your entire argument is “without the context of the site we’re on, no-one could know what this is referring to”, as if this was some sort of “both sides” bullshit, which you claim to despise.
But the argument I'm making is that both sides are guilty of claiming the other side is defending genocide not that both sides are guilty of committing genocide right now. The argument that one side is defending genocide is bad faith, as other than a few extremists nobody on either side is actually defending genocide.
id…” The fact that you feel the need to accuse someone you’ve never seen of being a kid instead of pointing out what’s actually wrong
INSTEAD OF
I very clearly pointed out what's wrong with your.
But the argument I’m making is that both sides are guilty of claiming the other side is defending genocide
"Both sides"
See. You're pulling the ridiculous "both sides" bullshit.
The argument that one side is defending genocide is bad faith
No it isn't. You're just pretending it is, willfully ignoring the reality of the situation. Israel is most definitely defending a genocide.
“I have ordered a complete siege on the Gaza Strip. There will be no electricity, no food, no fuel, everything is closed,” Gallant says following an assessment at the IDF Southern Command in Beersheba.
“We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly,” he adds.
THE HAGUE, Netherlands (AP) — Accused of committing genocide against Palestinians, Israel insisted at the United Nations' highest court Friday that its war in Gaza was a legitimate defense of its people and that it was Hamas militants who were guilty of genocide.
More than 23,000 people in Gaza have been killed during Israel’s military campaign, according to the Health Ministry in the Hamas-run territory. That toll does not distinguish between civilians and combatants. Nearly 85% of Gaza’s people have been driven their homes, a quarter of the enclave’s residents face starvation, and much of northern Gaza has been reduced to rubble.
... this amounts to genocide and is part of decades of Israeli oppression of Palestinians.
“The scale of destruction in Gaza, the targeting of family homes and civilians, the war being a war on children, all make clear that genocidal intent is both understood and has been put into practice. The articulated intent is the destruction of Palestinian life,” said lawyer Tembeka Ngcukaitobi, adding that several leading politicians had made dehumanizing comments about people in Gaza.
https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1147976
#Rights expert finds ‘reasonable grounds’ genocide is being committed in Gaza
You still aren't addressing the point they were making. They weren't claiming either side to be ethically, morally, or objectively correct. They were simply stating that both sides of the conflict have claimed the other is attempting a genocide of their own side.
You are trying to argue the objective facts of the situation, poorly at that, not the propaganda. They were commenting on the propaganda, not the facts.
I am.
The point is that him demanding there's "both sides" to this is true as much as it would be true that "both sides claim the other has false science" when arguing Flat Earthers.
It's disingenious and bad faith to pretend there are "both sides" to this. There aren't.
I can show you thousands of pages and people talking about Israel committing genocide on Palestine.
Can you show me a single page where anyone says that PALESTINE is committing trying to commit genocide?
Hint: google "palestine genocide" and "israel genocide" and tell me just how many links concern Palestinians being the victims of a genocide and how many there are saying they're committing one?
Yes, Israel loves to yell about "Hamas is trying to kill us" but Hamas isn't Palestine and an attack on a country doesn't qualify as genocide. Not to even mention how hypocritical it is of Israel to accuse Hamas of a genocide in the current situation when they're fervently trying to deny the genocide they're committing in broad daylight. Almost as ironic as you saying my arguing is poor. Thanks for the laughs, lol.
From the river to the sea, Israel shell be free!
I'm joking but Israeli politicians do use similar rhetoric to justify wiping out Palestine