5mo ago

A Modern Private Messenger

In light of what's happened to Durov and possibly seeing Telegram compromised, I'm doubling my efforts to find a new main messenger. Before you start, not Signal as it's a bad fit for the needs of me, my family and friends.

So what do I need?

The ability to run on multiple devices. Me, my family and friends all have multiple Android devices.
The ability to run on desktop. Linux and Windows.
Built in sticker repository. What can I say, I like to lazy flirt.
Animated Emoji. I like my messenger experience vibrant.
Material You. Again with the vibrancy, but also, it's a sign of modernity.
Phone number linking. My family and friends are lazy as hell.
Synchronized chats. I don't mind self hosting a bridge, but the ability to see messages on multiple devices is a must.
Voice Messages
Video Calls
Group Video Calls
Stories integrated into as first class citizens
Private. If you suggest WhatsApp, I'm assuming you're either stupid or a troll.

Can anyone recommend anything?

50 comments

Signal is modern as in modern, good cryptography. Most of development time went into that.
With security, you always need to trade-off convenience and bling features. "Lazy as hell" don't go well with that. I can understand lacking group video calls and ability to run on multiple devices, but not "sticker repository" and "animated emojis". I wish they didn't spend time on the Stories feature either, it's supposed to be a messenger, not a social media platform.
- The problem with Signal is getting other people to use it.
  Part of that issue is "the dropping of support for SMS, and the awful UI/UX.
  
  I think the challenge of getting others to use anything other than what they’re used to is going to be the same regardless what that anything is. I know people who have continued to use something no matter how many articles were published about its security flaws, data harvesting and spying. They just don’t care. It’s what they know and it’s what their friends know.
  So if you’re going to have to change someone else’s mind, pick what you like best because that won’t be the deal-breaker.
  
  Isn't it the opposite? I always thought Signal is pretty much the only private messenger that has any chance of mass adoption. I mean, most people at least heard about it which is already a lot in comparison to others.
  Also, personally I actually really like the UI/UX. I'm curious, could you elaborate what you don't like about it?
  Regarding SMS support... Yeah, I agree. I really miss that feature.
  
  what's wrong with the ui?
  
  the dropping of support for SMS
  Disagree. The fact that most people are clueless about types of messaging and don't distinguish between SMS, MMS, RCS, iMessage, Signal, Messenger, WhatsApp, Telegram, Line and so on just caused extra confusion for regular users. Removing SMS support from Signal was totally justified
- Signal doesn't lack group video calls. It can support video calling up to 40 devices at once.
- I think the problem is, is that there's a bunch of people who don't get that modern day communication has changed. Things like Stories and Stickers are a big part of modern day communicating. The cost shouldn't be not being able to do pretty standard things.
  
  Signal has stories and stickers tho
  
  I might use emoticons sometimes but that's about it. If there's a population that absolutely can't live without Instagram like short-length videos all the time, then there's an equivalent population who considers it feature bloat.
  I see your opinion however you have been exceedingly rude in many comments on this thread, even to good people who answered you in good faith.

Sticker repository? lol, Telegram has that market cornered and you know it :)
https://matrix.org/ is probably the only reasonable solution to your problem but reading between the lines you're inferring that Telegram is dead in the water.
I'm a popcorn fanantic and await to see the, corns?
- We would not recommend Matrix for security considering the recently admitted their old encryption code was bad and a lot of clients are still using their old encryption code:
  https://soatok.blog/2024/08/14/security-issues-in-matrixs-olm-library/

Matrix, Signal, and Threema are the main contenders. Nothing else comes close to all your preferences. For stickers/emoji/gifs, you’ll probably need a third party keyboard, but I don’t have any recommendations for those.
- Matrix should not be considered as their security has been pretty bad until recently (they intentionally shipped bad code and knew about it for years): https://soatok.blog/2024/08/14/security-issues-in-matrixs-olm-library/ and many clients still use that bad code.
  Threema has been pretty bad historically: https://soatok.blog/2021/11/05/threema-three-strikes-youre-out and their desktop offering is not one-to-one with the mobile apps, it's pretty limited in what it can do and has to have a device connected to the network at all times, open on the app and unlocked with the screen on.
- Signal stickers is a good enough repo to integrate them

What makes signal unsuitable? That’ll help spark some ideas.
- 1, 3, 4, 5, 7 and 11
  
  Which one of those can signal not do?

Why not signal? It fits your criteria... If not, try GNU Jami, it's well designed but not material you, and has most of your features.
Edit: Session is another messenger which has some of your features you might want
- Why not signal? It fits your criteria...
  Okay, I'll bite. Tell me how it fits my criteria, using the bullet point list provided.
  
  X The ability to run on multiple devices. Me, my family and friends all have multiple Android devices. ✔️ The ability to run on desktop. Linux and Windows. X Built in sticker repository. What can I say, I like to lazy flirt. X Animated Emoji. I like my messenger experience vibrant. ✔️(partial Material You. Again with the vibrancy, but also, it's a sign of modernity. ✔️ Phone number linking. My family and friends are lazy as hell. ✔️ Synchronized chats. I don't mind self hosting a bridge, but the ability to see messages on multiple devices is a must. ✔️ Voice Messages ✔️ Video Calls ✔️ Group Video Calls ✔️? Stories integrated into as first class citizens
  Not sure what you meant by stories integrated as first class citizens. Signal does have stories, though.
  In summary, signal fits your criteria quite well, only missing out on full material you support, stickers, and animated emojis. I may be missing an app, but I believe that this is the best you will get without going for telegram.
  Edited for accuracy

The only thing that fits most of your needs is Signal, we have looked into this heavily and nothing has as many features, is as easy to use as and has a strong of focus on privacy and security as Signal, so it's either that or Whatsapp.
You can techically use signal on multiple devices, by linking them instead of setting them up as each their own 'host', if you want it on multiple phones or multiple android devices you'll likely have to use Molly, I believe this would work, but am unsure.
Matrix should not be considered because of this:
https://soatok.blog/2024/08/14/security-issues-in-matrixs-olm-library/
and Threema is pretty bad historically ( https://soatok.blog/2021/11/05/threema-three-strikes-youre-out/ ), even though they have improved in the last year or two, but their desktop offering is pretty awful, as unless you want to use the beta and use iOS then you have to keep your device attached to the network, on and open on Threema only.
Signal really is the only option here.
- I definitely don't consider WhatsApp to be private, Signal doesn't support multiple Android devices and Threema sounds pretty useless. So it would seem there's no real options? Which is a shame.
  
  Yup, all the 'more private' ones like SimpleX or Session don't have as many features and are have pretty suspicious funding sources (or involved in crypto).
  WhatsApp might be private but there's no way to be 100% sure, since it's closed source and can leak some messages in reports which is intentional.
  Yes and no about Signal supporting multiple Android devices, the Molly fork might be able to if you set it up as a linked device, and we know that apple tablets can be linked in the actual Signal app.

Hey. Signal is the way. I think you can't find everything, exactly the way you want it. Signal doesn't support multidevices on Android but you can use Molly which is a signal fork. It's basically the same but you can connect it to many android devices.

i use jmp.chat it meets several of your requirements I have no idea if it meets others

Sorry, but the more private messaging apps just aren't there as commercial data hoggers. If you absolutely need stickers and perfect material you and other features, just use WhatsApp and train your family members to use PGP on Android. Maintain a secondary identity for sensitive stuff with SimpleX/Briar

I recommend you stop being so lazy. Or use whatsapp, or get your stickers from gboard and use signal.

50 comments