Moving to China as a westerner:what should I expect and what do I need to do?
Moving to China as a westerner:what should I expect and what do I need to do?
I tried asking on reddit, but tbh everyone is an asshole over there and were not giving me very detailed answers
This is gonna be a fairly complex question with a fairly complex answer, I know. A few things to preface to reassure that I'm not dashing into this without thinking.
1.I am not moving tomorrow. I'm getting my degree in my home country first, and then moving. (Obviously I will ask again when the time comes, since policies and situations can change)
2.I am planning on learning and becoming proficient(if not fluent) in Chinese
3.Im planning on taking internships and will have a degree in an industrial field, so I won't be completely unqualified for potential positions.
4.I know china isn't luxury gay space communism
Anyway, what I wanted to ask is a few subquestions in relation to one big overall question.
A.What is the process from getting from my country (the usa) to China going to be like? I mean, obviously I'm flying, but I've never moved countries before so I want to know what I'll need to do beforehand, how long the process will take, and what might prevent me from going in the first place
B.Is there any specific locations in China that you would recommend? Personally I'm thinking either Shanghai or Chongqing, however I generally just don't know where I'd fit in to start. I understand if I might not be perfect for a recommendation, but if there are some ideas that I could he presented with, I would greatly appreciate it, and I can always move to a different area later
(Edit:I'm also from an area with very few natural disasters. Should I move somewhere more inland, or northern, since I don't have experience in preparation and evacuation and such)
C.What is the process and what should I expect for getting a job? I live in the US, so how do I go about getting a job offer from a Chinese company to get a work visa. What would make me more viable as a canidate (besides language skills and a degree and experience, obviously)
D.The great firewall and such. How worried should I be about what I say, both in person and on social media? Also, how much access will I have to the non-chinese world? I've been told there might be access to VPNs, but I feel like that defeats the purpose of the great firewall, no?
E.Services. How does getting access to Healthcare, legal services, etc. Go when I'm not a citizen?
F.How worried should I be about day to day life and crime? How much more/less worried should I be about getting mugged/assaulted/burglarized (obviously depending on the area.)
G.How do I deal with the inevitable culture shocks I'll have?
And finally
H.Will there be any possibility of me obtaining Chinese citizenship? If yes, how long will it take, and what will and won't be available for me for the time im not a citizen? I checked the naturalization law, and it says if I'm stateless I can apply for citizenship if I'm "settled," but I dont exactly know what that means.
I think that covers everything. I'll add as much detail about myself as I am willing to share online (which isn't a ton). Thank you in advance for any help in this matter.
Correct me if I’m wrong but it sounds like you haven’t visited China in person. I highly recommend that’s where you start. If you’re a student China is actually running a program called “Bridge of the Future” where they bring American students to visit China. Also, if you’re still in school I suggest doing some sort of language or study abroad program. That will give you a longer time to familiarize yourself with the country.
A. Flying there is easy. It wouldn’t be hard to figure out how to get your stuff to China.
B. You really should visit first. Shanghai is more westernized and thus may be less of a culture shock. That said, there are large cultural differences between cities including work/life balance.
C. It really depends. They do recruit foreigners, usually for technically skilled positions or to be English teachers. However, depending on where you’re at in school maybe consider applying to a graduate degree program in China. That would be the ideal way to build the connections you want.
D. The firewall is more or less intense depending on the province you visit. You will lose access to a lot of things you might find that you miss. However, people in China use VPNs all the time. The government doesn’t really seem to care that much either. I feel like the firewall has evolved into an economic protectionist measure to disincentivize Chinese citizens from using foreign social media. That said almost everyone I know in China has an instagram lol.
E. For these kinds of things you really do need to become literate in Mandarin. On legal documents they may provide translations. However if you use the translation you assume the risk that the translation isn’t accurate. Also, healthcare can be cheep but only if you go to providers that aren’t intended for foreigners.
F. It’s not uncommon for scammers to exist in some of the major cities where foreign tourists visit. However, I’ve rarely heard of any violent crimes being a problem. Personally I find Chinese cities much safer than European cities and especially US cities. That said like all cities it varies by neighborhood.
G. Honestly that’s part of why I suggest you visit first. There may be a lot of things about China that you may not like that are just a matter of personal preference. That includes cultural differences.
H. China doesn’t recognize dual citizenship. That means if you want to become a citizen you have to renounce any citizenships you currently have. If you are a citizen of the US or EU country I think doing this is just a plainly bad idea even if you intend to stay.
Lastly something you haven’t mentioned but I assume given where you’re posting that you may have an ideological motivation for wanting to move to China. I think that can be a little dangerous and set you up for failure if you don’t take things slow and visit the country or study there for a time as a I suggested. Here on lemmy, most of our discussion of China is shaped by western propaganda. That means we can get defensive and highlight the successes while deconstructing the myths. Rarely do we have the chance to critique China without risking the discussion devolving into western chauvinism. That said, by visiting China and engaging with it directly you’ll almost certainly find there are aspects of China you do not like. However, I expect the only meaningful way to understand what I mean would be to visit before you commit to moving there.
Forwarning:still getting use to lemmy ui so sorry if I fail to address anything.
Like I prefaced at the start, I'm planning on learning mandarin (through accredited courses. Sorry, I should've specified that)
And I understand visiting first. Just..well, yknow, the language thing. But I'll do that before moving. Thanks for recommending that bridge to the future program.
Thank you a lot for the comments on point C, a lot of people have just told me "you need a job for a work visa." Which I get, however I have no experience getting a job outside of my home country so knowing there will be agencies and such is helpful.
On point H, I understand they don't allow dual citizenship. On renouncing, are saying i shouldn't do that immediately or I shouldn't do it at all? I understand not doing it immediately if I don't like it though, obviously. But assuming that, what changes between a permanent resident and a citizen?
On the last point, I suppose it's a mix. If it was purely ideological, then I'd book a flight to occupied Korea a sprint across the DMZ tomorrow (/s). However, it also feels like one of the only places that isnt actively getting worse. Had I been born a few years earlier, maybe I'd move to Germany or Scandinavia, but those places also seem to be suffering from similar issues. Cuba would be closer language wise, but the blockade puts a damper on everything there. North korea is pretty isolated and I'd be worried about making a huge mistake by trusting them. Russia suffers from all of these issues and doesn't provide a lot to be desired. Ergo china and Vietnam seem to be the best options considering all of the factors-assuming I am actually able to learn the language. I'm willing to put up with a lot when push comes to shove though.
China is a large and diverse country. What you experience will vary depending on where you live.
Since you are not fluent in Mandarin I recommend that you start by sticking to major cosmopolitan cities where you have everyday life survival options where you can speak English. Food markets, hospitals, transportation.
I then recommend pushing your boundaries from there, getting as much practice as you can living without English. You have a safety net but want to avoid using it.
Once you are comfortable with social norms and language, you can contemplate moving elsewhere more easily. You can use travel as a way to get a sense for other ways of living. Traveling in China is inexpensive, you can easily visit many different regions, urban and rural, cosmopolitan and ancient cultural.
And then you can move wherever you want without concern. All of the above can happen within 1-2 years if you work at it.
Okay, so for your questions.
A. You need your visas all set up first. You'll need a job and a place to live. These are the things that can take time (months) because they depend on one another. Job first, then start the visa, then look for a place to live. You'll need to update your visa with the place you will live ASAP.
B. It is too large and diverse of a country. I recommend visiting large cosmopolitan cities, medium-sized ethnic cities, rural places, and designated cultural sights.
C. If you don't already have contacts to get a job, use an agency. Pay attention to their reputation.
D. You do not need to be worried at all, just get a VPN that's known to work.
E. People with work visas get healthcare at the same location as citizens. You will want to buy insurance. It is not expensive.
F. You should, more or less, not worry at all.
G. Have friends and a cultural safety ney. Cosmopolitan cities all have "expat" communities with restaurants and such (expats are just immigrants from white countries lmao). I would recommend using them as a refuge when you feel overwhelmed but to prioritize becoming comfortable with how most people in the city live, more or less. In many cities you can basically avoid ever leaving the expat bubble and that is very unfortunate.
H. Yes but it takes a very long time. The fastest way is to own a business in China, basically to provide capital. Most people can't or won't do that. It takes so long that I would recommend thinking about it once you get there rather than planning it now. But so long as you work or have certain other ties (e.g. a citizen spouse) you can officially live and work there with more or less all the rights and principles of a citizen outside of certain kinds if political involvement.
Bump
Why do you want to move? I can understand wanting to get away from the USA, but why pick China over eg the EU?