You can’t even pay people to have more kids
You can’t even pay people to have more kids
These countries tried everything from cash to patriotic calls to duty to reverse drastically declining birth rates. It didn’t work.
These countries tried everything from cash to patriotic calls to duty to reverse drastically declining birth rates. It didn’t work.
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If history is any guide, none of this will work: No matter what governments do to convince them to procreate, people around the world are having fewer and fewer kids.
In the US, the birth rate has been falling since the Great Recession, dropping almost 23 percent between 2007 and 2022. Today, the average American woman has about 1.6 children, down from three in 1950, and significantly below the “replacement rate” of 2.1 children needed to sustain a stable population. In Italy, 12 people now die for every seven babies born. In South Korea, the birth rate is down to 0.81 children per woman. In China, after decades of a strictly enforced one-child policy, the population is shrinking for the first time since the 1960s. In Taiwan, the birth rate stands at 0.87.
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The real reason why people don't have kids is because they suck. Kids are stupid and annoying. More and more people are waking up to this fact and starting to resist the social pressure."I can actually live my life instead of dedicating all my time and resources to something I don't even need? I'll have two of that please!"
If government wants kids let them raise the kids. Pay women to give birth and then put the kid in public system. Problem solved.
I mean, kids only really suck in a world where both parents have to work 40+ hours a week. You really don't have to dedicate all your time to them, but in a world with less and less community to help raise them and more and more work to grind your energy down, you have to dedicate far too much of your limited free time to them. I would love to be able to raise a kid or two myself. I loved working with kids. We should not be throwing them into some nebulous "public system."
Yeah, I'm not talking about the public system seriously. It's just to show it's not really about systematic solutions. We can come up with government supported solutions and they would be bad.
And I totally agree that if you don't have to work raising kids is not that terrible but it's also not really a solution because most people do actually want to work. If you give people a choice between kids and meaningful career a lot of people will still choose career and birth rates will still be low. And a lot of people will still simply choose not to have kids because even when you don't have to work bringing up a kid is actually really really difficult. My friends and co-workers keep having kids and yeah, sleep deprivation, no social life, no time for hobbies, lots of extra expenses, constant infections, hard time travelling even short distance... And that's only the first year or two, before any behavioural issues start or you have to decide if you prefer to give you're 10 yo unrestricted access to the internet or have him excluded from everything his friends do.
The information you get might be biased, because people love to vent about bad stuff, but do not mention the rewarding stuff, that makes it worth it.
Yeah, I've heard that argument and I don't buy it. What I see is people that are really burned out and borderline depressed. I don't believe a hug from their child before sleep fixes that. I believe it keeps them from going crazy but I don't think it makes it all worth it. Most people will simply not admit it because it's taboo.
Well since we are at anecdotal evidence. I am in the academics bubble, where quite a few of my friends also got children and they love it. You don't like kids, so you see all the problems that come with having children. You are looking for confirmation bias. There are more than enough people that do not hate children. I mean, we are kinda biologically programmed to procreate.
I totally get what you're saying but I think there's just so much pressure from society that it's all terribly biased. Last week I saw another very long article from a woman wondering if she should have kids or not and the comment section was full of people talking like they just realized having kids is optional. Watch any American TV show and you'll see how ingrained the idea that having kids is mandatory is. Average person is so programmed by society and media to have kids people think it's just what you have to do and yes, they will try to justify it but saying that it's actually very rewarding. I'm not saying that no one should have kids but I actually think that very few people have kids because they enjoy it. We're talking couples with good jobs, good benefits, lot's of family support and lot's of money. Most people don't have any of this but they still have kids.
My friend lost his apartment to a fire so I took him in with my wife and kids while he got back on his feet. He was working class, his parents were neglectful and died young, his other family hated him, and he was left to fight for scraps and fend for himself.
He saw me give love to my kids, he saw the freedom we gave them to explore the world around them and their feelings, to exist without fear. One day my friend got home from work and the two kids ran over screaming "UNCLE!" and hugged him. He teared up a little and hugged them back, then he asked me to chat outside for a bit.
He laid it all out and said he wants kids. He never thought he could subject them to the life he lived but after seeing mine he realized he didn't have to. He said watching them grow up and being a part of it has been very rewarding. He has since started a business, almost entirely stopped drinking and smoking, invested his money in multiple places, and is now dating.
Kids are a lot of work, but they're also fantastic at showing you what actually matters in life. So much of the bullshit we think matters is just fluff.
So? You want to have kids then have kids. No one is saying kids should be forbidden. What I'm saying is that a lot of people decide to have kids when they don't have enough time and money for it and have lousy experience. And a lot (and like really really a lot) of people are simply bad at parenting and their kids also have lousy experience. You were lucky to have the resources and skills to raise your kids right. Good for you. Problem is that when you say 'kids and fantastic' a lot of people think they are fantastic for everyone. We should be saying 'kids are fantastic if you have the resources, time and skills needed to take care of them properly' instead. The 'why don't you have kids? kids are fantastic!' attitude that's the problem. It makes people think they are missing out on something great when they don't have them and puts a lot of needles pressure on couples. Having kids shouldn't be the default, it should be an option for the right people.
You were a kid, though. Adults aren't just spawned, they grow from kids. Everyone seems to be talking about them (and old people, for that matter) as though they are a separate species of being. Kids are just immature people. Of course they suck. You did too, so did I.
But they are also awesome, and grow up to be adults. I had fun having kids. Taking them places, watching them grow and change, the funny things they say and the flashes of insight. Now most of them are adult people. I don't care if they have kids, they should do whatever they want. But I did enjoy the parenting. Sure, it's not convenient, it's life.
As a woman of almost 40 fucking thank you. I'm educated enough to know I don't have to fall for that bs.
People with your argument are stupid and annoying. Kids are great. They deserve better than our society.
Sorry, I didn't meant to say you're stupid. Some kids are great, I'm sure you're one of them.
Lol!