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I don't hate you, this defederation thing is something I don't like. It creates echo chambers. Reddit was an echo chamber, too. But it was one everyone creates for themselves, subscribe: privacy, linux and selfhost and your chamber of anti-GAFAM is ready to rock (for example).
Seeing Hexbear and other stuff in "All" helps to escape your own bubble and creates more divergent discussion.
I agree with your last statement 100%
I am generally against defederation and censorship.
In response to the OP of this topic though, people hate hexbears because of the constant hardcore brigading and the huge inline image abuse.
It's annoying as fuck. As soon as you smell a "lib", even though you are usually wrong, it just turns into a massive dogpile on anyone who doesn't share your identical belief structure.
That isn't debate, it's bullying. You have the numbers to pull it off but if it carries on you will absolutely end up defederated from everywhere.
brigading
Brigading is a made-up reddit thing. It used to be normal for forums to "raid" other forums, and if you couldn't deal with that, it was on you. However we are not "raiding" there is no organised movement to go somewhere and post on it. We see the same posts pop up in "all", and we have a large and active userbase, that's all that's happening.
huge inline image abuse
Yeah, that bug is getting worked on.
As soon as you smell a "lib", even though you are usually wrong, it just turns into a massive dogpile on anyone who doesn't share your identical belief structure
Yeah that's the story, but it's not really what I've been observing. Plenty of people that disagree with the hexbear userbase have had nice discussions. Generally I see users from other instances post condescending "gotchas" which then, rightly, get dogpiled on. They then cry "foul" as if they didn't themselves initiate the interaction on those terms. Either that or they will be met by a user willing to engage in good-faith discussion, but they instead choose to continue with condescention. I see a lot of "I'm not reading all that" and "lmao you really believe that?" in response to well-thought out responses, not to mention the many accusations of being a bot. These users are then treated as condescending dickheads, because hexbear has had a lot of issues with wreckers, so there's a pretty low tolerance for that kinda stuff. Hexbear generally has a hostile culture to bad-faith debatebro tactics.
Disagreements are common, so it's not really that. It's just a question of wether they're engaging in good faith or not. I see plenty of users post about stuff that's well outside the general culture, that then have a nice discussion.Regarding being "wrong about lib" I'm gonna disagree again. I think you have a different definition of what that is. Oftentimes we think of ourselves as being "leftists" or whatever, but by our words and actions we support the current (neo-liberal) system. Then it does not matter what we identify as, if we're still furthering something else. If you're interested in that kinda stuff you might want to read Combat Liberalism. It's pretty short, so it's a nice and quick primer.
Brigading is a made-up reddit thing. It used to be normal for forums to “raid” other forums, and if you couldn’t deal with that, it was on you. However we are not “raiding” there is no organised movement to go somewhere and post on it. We see the same posts pop up in “all”, and we have a large and active userbase, that’s all that’s happening.
You realise we can access hexbear.net and see the local posts? It's absolutely coordinated behaviour. Hexbear users post links to a given thread from another instance in chat or chapo or wherever with a suitably inflammatory title along with a call to arms along the lines of "Look at this terrible liberal take, OMG the entire cookie baking community is full of bigots and transphobes. Cookie bakers are bourgeois as hell!". Cue your entire community piling in to the cookie baking community to completely destroy all discussion of baking cookies until they get bored and move on.
You spend a lot of time talking about good faith discussions but from my perspective it's the hexbear community that isn't acting in good faith in most instances.
Regarding being “wrong about lib” I’m gonna disagree again. I think you have a different definition of what that is. Oftentimes we think of ourselves as being “leftists” or whatever, but by our words and actions we support the current (neo-liberal) system. Then it does not matter what we identify as, if we’re still furthering something else. If you’re interested in that kinda stuff you might want to read Combat Liberalism. It’s pretty short, so it’s a nice and quick primer.
I accept this, and I am guilty of this to the extreme. I was extremely politically active in my late teens and early 20's, and active in the labor movement. I have the criminal record as proof. I'm old as fuck now, and I have several people that depend on me NOT being in jail, and to continue pretending to be a functional member of our neo-liberal society to keep them from starving in the street.
I hate that the entirety of my time and energy is now exhausted on enriching "investors". I saw the system for what it is from a young age and fell into all of the traps anyway. The traps are effective, but that does not mean that my political ideology is in alignment with the system that sets them. Still, I acknowledge your point that things cannot change without action, and most times that means violent and illegal action. The system is built to protect itself.
As for your link... Mao Tse-tung killed, brutalised and starved to death more human beings than any other person that has ever lived. MILLIONS dead. If the society you seek to build is based on that same, tired old philosophy then I will fight you every step of the way. It's a very strange person that looks at the history of China over the last 100 years and decides they'd like to repeat it.
You realise we can access hexbear.net and see the local posts? It's absolutely coordinated behaviour. Hexbear users post links to a given thread from another instance in chat or chapo or wherever with a suitably inflammatory title along with a call to arms
Do you think we're having users make accounts on defederated instances? We have a specific rule against "brigading" federated instances because it had like one thread about Ada where it actually happened. This is you jumping at shadows.
Mao Tse-tung
The modern romanization is Zedong, philistine.
killed, brutalised and starved to death more human beings than any other person that has ever lived.
Tell me about how much you aren't a lib.
If the society you seek to build is based on that same, tired old philosophy then I will fight you every step of the way.
As opposed to what? Anarchism? That's even older! But no, associating you with anarchists gives you too much credit. Tell us about how we should put more stock in whatever boutique ideology you pseudo-leftist piss sommeliers have cooked up lately instead of the ones that have actually gained ground or even exist outside of the internet.
It's a very strange person that looks at the history of China over the last 100 years and decides they'd like to repeat it.
It's a very strange person that talks about "the history of China over the last 100 years" while having themselves studied so little of it.
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Try another example, but this time try and bully someone into revolutionary thought and see how it goes.
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As soon as you smell a "lib", even though you are usually wrong
We're actually 100% correct, just fyi. A lot of people don't know that about us
Yes, you are absolutely the smartest ones in the room. All rooms. At all times.
I suspect the userbase of hexbear skews extremely young. I too had everything figured out when I was younger.
Yes, you are absolutely the smartest ones in the room. All rooms. At all times.
As opposed to you, who definitely doesn't roleplay being the "smartest one in the room" and speak in condescending generalizations about a large group of political others. Never ever.
If you are still seriously reading communist theory beyond the age of 20, I've got some truly terrible news for you. You should probably stay out of rooms altogether before anyone puts it together for you.
We all know you're using that isle of man flag as a coward's version of the afrikaner flag. You're so god damn bad at this.
A) I don't know the first thing about an Afrikaner flag.
B) I was born there
Try again.
I hope you get the Praxis you are looking for one day.
Yep. Doesn't change where I was born. Us filthy "libs" are a bit more mobile than you lot. I've lived in a lot of countries, and I've visited half the world including China which is why I don't need to engage any further on this. None of you have a clue what you are talking about. You are singing the praises of a country that is a living hell for 99% of its inhabitants, even moreso than filthy capitalist strongholds.
China is a living hell for 99% of its inhabitants which is why they overwhelmingly approve of their government and are overall happier and more optimistic about the future than people living in western “democracies” , you sure are smart dude
Us filthy "libs" are a bit more mobile than you lot. I've lived in a lot of countries, and I've visited half the world including China which is why I don't need to engage any further on this.
This is a fantastic way to piss off poor and marginalized people, flaunting your privilege and using it in a context to assert some flavor of chauvinistic superiority over us. You're only digging the grave of your class further and further by being a jerk that thinks their own shit doesn't stink, which is fine with me as I enjoy skipping to the end of direct class conflict. The people you step on are the vast majority on this planet, and they recognize which class actually shares their interests based on how they are treated, so you're just giving us more comrades and bolstering solidarity by throwing them into our open arms, critical support to you in that regard.
You said you've "visited China"... When? When precisely did you visit China, and where did you actually go? What's your story here?
You are singing the praises of a country that is a living hell for 99% of its inhabitants, even moreso than filthy capitalist strongholds.
Complete projection here. Everything you said is basically true in regards to specifically the United States, but also the Western world in general, which is only worsening in living conditions for the working class as time goes on. You failed to elaborate on why you assert China to be a "living hell" for 99% of its inhabitants. Do you have any actual tangible examples, or is this just like all the other bullshit claims that are taken at face value as Gospel Truth because liberal media monopolies in the West, with the US at its core and main source, endlessly hammer these things into the heads of the population?
See, unlike you, a person who speaks, condescends and sneers from an ivory tower of privilege, the vast majority of us cannot afford to just take luxury vacations and go wherever we want. Your demographic treat the poor of other countries like zoo animals, finding it a good time to travel to poorer places and ooo and awe at the less fortunate to reinforce your confidence in grandstanding to flex and scoff at those that oppose your class interests and intend to fight against them.
Here. I may not have the wealth to travel around the world, but I'm resourceful enough to have found some concrete examples of this "living hell" you spoke of. Check it out:
Things You CAN Do in China (You CAN'T Do in America) Americans WON'T Believe It...
Apartment Tour in China | What can $300 a month get you? 🇨🇳
China vs USA - Please DON'T Compare... (Americans Crying) (CW for the vegans: meat carving/eating)
China LEADS the World in Electric Cars! (America Shocked)Next time you want to talk about socialist nations being inferior to the living hell that capitalist nations have cultivated for their own people, bring receipts. If you refuse to engage in the concrete examples I have provided, don't even bother replying because I'm not interested in bad faith conversation.