We’re over-freezing our food. Turning up the temperature slightly could avoid 17 Mt of CO2
We’re over-freezing our food. Turning up the temperature slightly could avoid 17 Mt of CO2
“This temperature corresponds to 0 degrees Fahrenheit, so it was “probably a round, easy number to remember”
That’s what Allouche and team will be working on next, as they build their research summary into a full report, to be published in September 2024. “These findings give good reasons for ‘3 degrees of change’ to be further explored,” Allouche says.
Three Degrees Of Change: Frozen food in a Resilient and Sustainable Food System (PDF)
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"We" as in multimillion dollar companies with 30 acre refrigeration centeres right? Since corps produce like what 70% of all emissions?
No. It’s like when toilets started getting smaller flushes. It doesn’t help on an individual basis, but as a whole it has an impact, even if it’s not a huge one.
curious how its always us who end up footing this kind of bill, never the big refrigeration centers and such.
They're probably already running at the optimum temperature. Power is their main input cost, and they're strongly motivated to minimize it. Meanwhile the average household freezer is set to... Um... how about "7". That sounds pretty cold to me, yeah?
You wouldn't believe how much research has gone into studying things like the optimum way to store potatoes.
mine is usually set to minimum, believe it or not people have power bills too, and at the end of the day it gets priority over whatever the optimum temperatures are. spoiling food has an indirect hard to quantify impact, but power bills come every month with a big fat number on it.
the difference is most of them wouldn't be making as much money, but most of us might not be making rent.
at the end of the day they don't need to convince me if they really want to sell me shoddier fridges, because they are the ones calling those shots. turns out its a moot point anyway sadly.
Meanwhile the average household freezer is set to… Um… how about “7”. That sounds pretty cold to me, yeah?
My chest freezer doesn't even have numbers on its dial. It just goes
min - mid - max, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Edit: The more I think about it, the more I want to get a logging thermometer and a power meter and figure out what temperature and energy use those settings correspond to. The neat thing is, once I finish building my heatermeter I'll actually be able to do it!
I don't know why the dials on fridges and freezers don't have temperatures on them. Is 7 warmer or colder than 3? Is "high" the highest temperature or the lowest? At least my new fridge has additional labels showing that 5=coldest.
Also, I looked at your project. It looks interesting, but it also looks like your project timelines resemble my own! :) I'm 15 years into my "Wall of Text" project and after numerous false starts and changed objectives, it's current state is the welcome page saying I got the server software installed and configured.
To be clear, the heatermeter isn't my project; I'm just assembling one. I've got most of it soldered; I just need to 3D-print the case, add the LEDs (which need the case for proper alignment), install the software on an SD card, and then fire it up and see if it works.
Then, for the freezer-logging idea, I'd need to figure out how to log the data it provides and correlate it with the data from one of my ESPHome-flashed Sonoff S31s. I might see if I can get Home Assistant to do it, since I want to integrate my thermometer with it anyway so it can do stuff like flash a light when it's time for me to go outside and stoke the fire in my offset smoker.
The freezer has a far simpler ready-made solution, an Acurite or Lacrosse outdoor sensor ($10-20), an RTLSDR dongle ($10) and rtl_433 to put the data on MQTT.
I do my data logging with the free version of Mango Automation SCADA which integrates very well with MQTT and is lightweight and cross platform.
Got a sensor in each of my freezers and my root cellar, rtl_433 also picks up my weather station and rain gauge, wireless buttons, motion sensors and more, rtl_433 is a great addition to any home automation system and cheap and easy to set up.
Yes, that would be better for people who weren't already doing what I'm doing.
Oddly enough, I've actually also got a RTLSDR dongle lying around. The only thing I don't have is an outdoor temperature sensor, but instead of getting one I'll stick with my current plan and save a weather station and/or permanent/continuous freezer monitoring for a future project.
Yup, I was suggesting it as an additional option where you can leave your heatermeter permanently installed on your smoker, and also monitor your freezer with minimal effort. Running rtl_433 is like a 5 minute project, and even an original Pi can run it with cycles to spare.
FWIW I found the best way to improve freezer energy performance is to drop your ambient temperature. This improves the COP and cuts cycle time more dramatically than changing the cold side setpoint (assuming you don't have the freezer really cranked to near the limits of the compressor).
My freezer is in the coldest part of my house, mostly by coincidence as that's the part nobody really lives in, with the laundry and such. It's zoned off to mostly just be kept above freezing by passive heat.
Oops, sorry about that!
Fridges with a dial usually are an uncalibrated simple analog thermostat sensor (often a gas tube with a pressure switch) along with a simple analog control board. Fridges with a digital thermostat tend to use a calibrated sensor (usually a thermocouple) with a digital control board.
Thanks for the answer! I knew there was a reason, but didn't expect it to be as reasonable. The only analog thermostats I'm familiar with have bimetal coils, so that's what was in my head.
IDK maybe something to do with the fact that they are providing a service that only runs because it's popular and used?
For what it's worth there is tons of regulation on this shit. It just doesn't say what you want it to say. Commercial energy use commonly followed a completely different rate structure.
I'd this why it takes multiple flushes to do the job these days, when my toilet at home handles it in one? Oof
"Corporation are responsible for 70% of the emissions" is how genZs defy all personal responsibility.
You all fuks are buying stuff, which is how those emissions happen. To feed your consumerism.
Stop buying refrigerated food and bam, no refrigerators will be run tomorrow.
Watch your own carbon footprint instead of constantly blaming corps. When you start consuming sustainability, the corps will follow.
Wow, full bootlicker.
Telling young people to downgrade their lifestyle without asking corporations to take accountability.
Putting shareholder value above human value.
Keep living your life like you used to, watch the planet implode, scream about corpos on in the internet to ease the pain.
In the meantime, if everyone just did that, downgraded their lifestyle, we'd all be fine.
No we wouldn't. If the biggest polluters do nothing we don't stop climate change.
And we all need shelter, food, water, and clothing. We can't stop consumption from corporations altogether.
Agriculture, construction, manufacturing, and transport are inevitable continuations. We can only do so much by voting with our wallets. We need to vote at the ballot box for regulation and laws.
You can now go and buy fair-trade clothing instead of that made by child labor, do you? You can now go and buy vegan and mostly locally produced food, do you? You can now stop buying useless sh1t online that's shipped from China, arguably slightly harder, but did you even bother? You can now choose to live in a place with better public transport, and bridge the gap by cycling, do you? You can now stop flying, did you?
No. You continue being a financial reason for burned rainforest (your steak and avocado toast), child labor (your new brand sneakers) and shipping emissions (everything), while sitting on your couch and blaming whoever.
Looking at that rant. I'm pretty sure I have a lower carbon footprint than you.
In fact my decisions at work probably put me in a negative carbon bracket. I've certainly reduced many people's carbon footprint by more than my personal footprint can ever be.
Although I may make myself some steak and avocado toast now you've mentioned it, so the daily total will take a hit. Never had steak on toast before.
Both our carbon footprints are a rounding error. The only thing we can do to affect climate change is vote people in who will do something about it, protest.
I've not flown anywhere in 18 years. I might or might not fly somewhere on holiday soon. But if I do fly I'll sleep soundly.
You on the other hand have probably done nothing to reduce anyone's carbon footprint except your own and it's still multiple times the average of an individual globally speaking.
Use the power you have to do something, even if it's just voting. Don't rant at people on the internet who don't live in a hut on the equator living off their own small holding.
You're talking to people that think the economy is only money made by rich people. It's not the goods they buy at the store, shipping or storing those goods. Or the industries that make trucks, trains and planes to deliver them. Just CEO profits.
The fuck did you expect?
- “carbon footprint” was invented by corps specifically to shift blame away from them onto consumer shoulders
- “consuming sustainably” only works when corps aren’t actively promoting artificial scarcity and manufactured demand
- where “consuming sustainably” does work is for your own peace of mind
Your own carbon footprint is something you can actively affect.
But sure, keep flying to 5 vacations a year, drive everywhere, eat meat for every meal, and when asked about climate change just blame dem corpos. Seems reasonable.
>Stop buying refrigerated food and bam, no refrigerators will be run tomorrow
did you try that?
I barely buy refrigerated food, I have little understanding why people do. But that's, you know, my personal preference. Yet, if everyone happened to have the same preference, you'd see all that refrigerated food products disappear.
I skip that aile in the supermarket. Imagine everyone does the same. Very soon the isle will go away. Dead simple.
And if you can't live without refrigerated food, stop blaming corpos for running the fridges. This is some next level hypocrisy.
But most frozen and refrigerated food is not in people's homes but in commercial food production warehouses and grocery stores. Without refrigeration a massive portion of food produced today would go bad as well, it would require an entire change of how food is produced and processed to remove refrigeration. Even produce you buy at the store at room temperature is refrigerated or frozen for days or weeks before it's sold.