Biden supporters mostly back him in 2024 election because they oppose Trump, poll finds
Biden supporters mostly back him in 2024 election because they oppose Trump, poll finds
Poll comes as the Biden campaign has ramped up its rhetoric in attacking Trump directly in recent weeks
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Biden won 2020 in spite of being Joe Biden, it's why it took almost 40 years for him to win his first presidential primary, people just don't ot want him as president.
Now that we've had him for four years, and he was worse than we expected...
I really don't think he can pull out another razor thin win like in 2020.
We're risking trump so we can have a Dem president that's more conservative than Dem voters want.
There's no logic behind it, except the donor class would rather have trump than a progressive. And just like AIPAC, they decided it's easiest to just buy both parties in the primary.
This is the third election and a row, it's not going to be different in 2028. If voters only requirement is "blue" then nothing is stopping either party from getting more and more conservative every election
How was Biden worse than expected?
Doesn't matter, all parent commenter needs to do is say it, and it's true!
I think he'd be worse if you expected him to not support Israel do a genocide, but if you expected that you should have read up on his positions and, frankly, the last 70 years of United States foreign policy.
Expecting or not doesnt affect being bad or not
Totally. But this is about wether he's below or above expectations. If your expectations were low then it stands to reason the bad things could match your expectations.
My bad i forgot expectations was the question asked
-Union strike busting
-Climate acceleration, more highways, more trucks and SUV's, banning affordable EVs
-Increased defense spending
-Higher deportations and now executive order asylum closing
-Renewed oil and gas leasing on federal lands, and weird restriction on leasing federal lands for renewable energy that more oil and gas leasing has to happen first
-The longest stretch of no minimum wage increase ever.
-rampant inflation
-lack of prosecution for a ton of crimes from Trump and other republicans
-no effort against Americas problem of gun violence
-campaigned on fixing a gap in subsidy coverage for health insurance for the lowest earning Americans, with no mention since
Not even mentioning the biggest problem people have with them, plenty of people have told you already.
Roe v. Wade was overturned under his mandate period as well. Sure it’s a Supreme Court decision, and the SC is mostly republican but it’s not like Biden couldn’t have pushed harder. He could, but then he wouldn’t be able to campaign on it.
“Vote for me and I’ll return some rights to people, maybe.”
Yes, it's all the Democrats' fault that six Republican appointed justices overturned Roe.
Bullshit.
It is absolutely their fault there are more Republicans in the Supreme Court. Justices aren't naturally occurring by unpredictable Acts of God.
It is also RBG's fault, while we're at it.
Your RGB point is the first one of merit. Sure should have left at an advantageous time.
The judges were appointed by a majority Republican Congress with a republican president. In what way could democrats stop it?
Scalia died almost a full year before Obama left office. That was his appointment, but the Dems didn't bother putting up a fight because they were convinced Clinton would be the next president and wanted to focus on the election. Then in freaking late October 2020, days before the election, they once again allowed another Trump appointment without putting up any sort of fight or stall tactic because they didn't want to rock the boat before the election.
The majority republican congress and the republican president are also their fault. They're pretty much the only ones running against them.
So more people should have voted Democrat, despite misgivings, to avoid a worse outcome that comes from not voting Democrat.
It's a two-party system, those are your choices.
That is exactly the kind of dogshit strategy that disenfranchises voters, loses elections and gives republicans a majority.
What "strategy?" That's what the system is. It's a two-party system, inherently.
You have two candidates to pick from. You either pick the candidate who is closer to your ideals or you pick the candidate that's farther away from your ideals. If you don't vote or you vote for a "third party" candidate then you're just throwing your choice away and abdicating it to those who do vote for one of those two options.
If you want it to be different from that then the fundamental voting system itself needs to be changed. The current one that America operates under inevitably becomes two-party. CPG Grey did a video a few years ago explaining why this is so.
In that case it's their parents faults for fucking.
It's not their parents fault they're incompetent corrupt pieces of shit. Or maybe it is a little bit, just not as much.
"Worse than expected," depends largely on the individual and what they were expecting. It comes down to expecting one thing and being disappointed in the outcome.
People who expected him to be an ally of immigrants are disappointed in his border policies.
People who expected him to fix Trumps "easy" trade wars are disappointed in his trade policies.
People who expected him to support labor are disappointed in his ban of the railroad workers strike.
People who expected him to champion human rights are disappointed in his support of the IDF.He may have met your expectations and the expectations of the majority of Democrats. Biden's 2020 victory depended on several groups who only showed up because they hoped that he would address their specific concerns.
People got confused when he ran on a platform that was "nothing will fundamentally change" and thought that meant he would push all the progressive ideas they wanted /s
And people up above are literally commenting that Biden is "the most progressive leader" we've had in several decades.
Because he's further right than Reagan and Bush Jr.
Because he’s further right than Reagan and Bush Jr.
Those 2 both gave gigantic tax cuts to the rich. Biden raised corporate tax rates. I can remember every president since Nixon and Biden has been the most progressive in my lifetime.
No he didn't. We're still under the tax rates Trump set in 2018 that dropped corporate tax rates to 21% and increased rates for lower and middle class individuals.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_tax_in_the_United_States#Federal_tax_rates
Biden raised the minimum corporate tax rate from 0% to 15% rather than simply reverse the Trump corporate tax rate reduction.
While the new taxes are “generally not positive for stocks,” the 15% corporate minimum tax won’t be “material,” Wells Fargo analysts wrote in an Aug. 9 research note that called the new taxes “modest.”
Just over 170 companies in the S&P 500 paid less than 15% in taxes last year, according to a new analysis by Credit Suisse. Of those corporations, less than half would likely see a tax hike for 2023 since the legislation allows companies to use adjusted earnings, which can be massaged in a number of ways, the analysis found.
So a very modest increase for roughly 80 companies. Really groundbreaking stuff here.
In passing the bill, they also stripped out universal child care and tax cuts for the middle class. Business as usual it seems. Lots of money for energy companies and health insurance companies and nothing for the working person.
So a very modest increase for roughly 80 companies. Really groundbreaking stuff here.
Enough to significantly reduce the deficits and pays for some social spending and climate change efforts.
This is projected to bring in up to $30B per year. The current deficit for the year is already at $855B and projected to hit $1.6T. Hardly a drop in the bucket.
I won't argue that it's bad these corporations are now paying at least a little bit in taxes, but this is pretty pathetic for some 'landmark' legislation.
Nope. The figure is $3.6 trillion over 10 years.
[The Biden Administration on May 28, 2021, released its fiscal year (FY) 2022 budget...the Biden Administration proposes to increase taxes on the wealthy and corporations and to enhance Internal Revenue Service (IRS) compliance, information and enforcement initiatives, projected to raise $3.6 trillion in revenues over a decade.]
And in the future, another $4 trillion in taxes on the wealthy.
https://taxfoundation.org/blog/biden-tax-increases-2023-budget-proposal/
Your own link from earlier has this right in the header's bullet points in reference to the bill that was actually signed into law not an analysis of a proposal from a year and a half prior:
The more than $430 billion package is expected to reduce the deficit by more than $300 billion over a decade.
The wealthy haven't had their taxes increased so I don't know where this $4T is supposed to come from unless IRS audits are going to find $4T worth of unpaid revenue.
Some people think the entire world and everything in it can be changed on a dime. I have to constantly tell people things take time.
A lot of the problems we're facing are not something we can wait on. Climate change is already going to effectively change our life to an unrecognizable extent, even with a Democrat is charge.
Perhaps too many people have grown comforted by the inevitable. I'm still a little panicked, and it doesn't seem like anyone's doing anything to stop it.
A lot of the problems we’re facing are not something we can wait on. Climate change is already going to effectively change our life to an unrecognizable extent,
Then it is a good thing Biden rules and Convicted Felon Treason Trump drools in his diaper.
Did I say we can wait on them? No. I said change takes time. And it does. Can we go out and ask everyone on the planet/US to change out their car for an EV tomorrow? No we can't. Things take time. Sounds like you should have beef with the people that protested voted against Jimmy Carter, against Gore, and against Hillary. We should have moved the needle a long time ago.
And there are still other items to be worked on that people demand, like student debt, the economy, unions, chips act, ukraine, etc. Things take time.
Why are you talking about things taking time as if we're slowly progressing in the right direction? Hell no, we've been moving in the direction of more gas powered truck and SUV sales, more gas production, more highways, all of it promoted by democrats.
First the entire context was "How was Biden worse than expected?" to which I answered that some people think everything can happen on a dime, which they can't because they take time.
Second, we are moving in the right direction. Unprecedented green energy policies, EV incentives, charging infrastructure, pretty sure there was stuff for train building, quick googling says $20.5 Billion for transit funding https://www.transportation.gov/briefing-room/biden-harris-administration-provide-205-billion-federal-funding-support-transit. Congrats, you showed you are the exact person that thinks the world can all change on a dime.
And some 20 times more than that is going to highways
Two-thirds ($432 billion) of that $643 billion is flowing to conventional highway programs. https://t4america.org/iija/
Meanwhile, gas guzzling SUV sales have skyrocketed recently https://www.theautopian.com/heres-the-exact-year-suv-sales-overtook-sedan-sales-in-america/
As for EV incentives, China has been dominating with EV adoption lately with affordable options. Theyve got a damn 11k brand new EV that is so enticing, the US and EU are banning it from import because it would be too successful here.
Ahh the "not enough!", aka "not fast enough!" You want more? Then vote Dems in consistently and overwhelmingly.
And then the "it's not changing fast enough!". You do realize those are private purchases right? The government can't mandate what people buy.
And then the China tariff. Like it it not they're going to protect American industry from low wage made cars.
So we're basically back to, congrats you just showed you're exactly the "not fast enough!" person. And we are moving in the right direction with, well everything I already listed. You want to move faster? Give Dems overwhelming and consistent victories.
I really think you're missing the point. Not fast enough is not good enough when we're talking about climate change! Yes, we had to take drastic actions yesterday, and the best thing we can do is take drastic actions today. We're just kicking the can down the road, and I don't think there's any road left.
My entire point is that there are certain categories of things in which you do not have time to act, and you must do it quickly and firmly.
No I'm not missing the point. I want it to be done fast, I know that things take time. Saying "not fast enough" is not a valid complaint of Biden or of Dems because the reality of the world is that things take time. And the reality whether you like it or it not, climate change is not even a winning issue. People rank issues as 1 economy 2 inflation 3 in distant third place abortion.
But back to this topic, I really wonder what industry you work in that you think we can flip a switch and the world changes.
Think about this. Want to build a new metro line? Good idea right, it'll reduce car usage. From the day you say "here's money, go", it will take minimum 4 years, more likely minimum 6 years. For a single line. Then you have the other guy complaining "but there are still car sales". No fucking shit, it's not built yet. Things take time whether you like it or not.
So which is it? Other people are saying that if Trump gets reelected, democracy will end instantly.
Seems like "things take time" only when neoliberal Democrats get criticized for their shitty policy.
Progress takes time, effort, and hard work.
Stagnation (or regression) takes fuck all. It takes fuck all effort to block things. The GOP can do that with control of only one of the 3 (house, senate, presidency). Which they've had for 20 of the last 24 years.
It takes fuck all effort to block things. The GOP can do that with control of only one of the 3 (house, senate, presidency). Which they've had for 20 of the last 24 years.
That goes both ways, and yet we've seen Republicans pass all kinds of vile legislation in that time. If "it takes fuck all effort to block things" then why aren't Democrats doing that too?
What the GOP wants is lack of progress. They want to hit the giant pause button on society. They want to block progress from happening. That's why the GOP benefits more from blocking things. What the Dems want is actual progress - new bills, new laws, new measures. That requires legislation to actually pass. So no, it doesn't work both ways.
The most the GOP wants to do is repeal what was already passed, and give tax breaks. It takes fuck all effort to do that. They get one house and they can demand tax breaks or they shut down the government. Or they try to repeal the ACA. They didn't write a well thought out replacement lol, all they want to do is repeal.
To actually write and pass progressive legislation takes a ton of actual work, effort, support, and time. And all 3 houses to pass it.
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The genocide he's not just supporting, but now actively involving US military in.
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Making trump border policies permanent law.
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Not fulfilling campaign promises
But like, please don't do that thing where because I didn't list every little thing, that I'm saying the only issues with Biden are the ones I listed.
I didn’t list every little thing
You listed 3 false things.
Frankly, all of that should have been expected.
If you expected #1 and still voted for him...
I dunno, but at least now people can't act like they don't understand how people voted for hitler.
I expected this shit from republicans, but way too many people who call themselves Dems are just ok with genocide.
Apparently all it took to get Dems to support genocide, is only give them the option of more genocide?
And republicans are all about genocide, so now neither party can be counted on to be consistently against genocide?
What I still don't understand, is why so many of you are just ok with it.
That’s the sound of the Overton window ratcheting to the right, and the democrats locking it in place
The one and only way to move the Overton window to the left is for the GOP to keep losing elections over and over and over.
What I don’t understand is knowing this… you still do your best to rally people to either not vote, or vote third party. Look, it’s a shit system. No one here is cheerleading for it. But because so few people chose to be activists in the off years between elections…
This is what we get when no one cares about politics when it actually matters. No. What we get are single-issue SJWs every election year shouting at everything trying to keep democrat alive while the rest of you whine about… whatever bothers you at the moment. And let’s not even mention the right-wing trolls among you that pretend to support your causes, but are only fanning the flames to prop up their boy.
And after all this… when the smoke clears in November, when the decision is made- ALL of you will disappear and reroll as victims of whatever that decision is.
I don’t understand is knowing this… you still do your best to rally people to either not vote, or vote third party.
And what I don't understand is whether this is to help War Criminal Putin or Convicted Felon and Sex Offender Treason Trump.
I guess it doesn't matter it all benefits the same Axis Powers.
The Axis of Evil
Treason Trump - War Criminal Putin - Comrade Xi - Monster King Kim Jong Un
On cool, liberals have stooped to screeching about "SJWs" who oppose genocide xD fuck off with your reactionary trash
It’s not SJWs that oppose genocide. News flash bud…
Everyone opposes genocide.
You’re not going to get away with your false equivalency here. Just because someone opposes the ignorance required to think that NOT voting will somehow move the needle in a chosen direction- does not mean they support genocide. So stop with this nonsense.
Now, either discuss this like a mature adult without insults, or walk away.
Liberals don't oppose genocide. Conservatives are very very supportive of genocide. Wtf is your point? And why use 2015 conservative speak to demean opposers of genocide?
ROFL!
It’s so easy to be outraged when you get to make up the shit that causes it. This shit is absolutely hilarious!
Liberal absolute oppose genocide. What you don’t seem to understand is that- liberals also know that if we don’t keep Trump from winning November- that genocide will actually be MUCH worse. PROVENLY.
So while you fold your arms and throw your temper tantrum over this single issue, the rest of us will try and keep America from becoming a dictatorship.
Lastly, go ahead and say incorrectly that by voting for Biden, it’s supporting genocide. Because with something like Project 2025 existing and NOT voting for the one person that has the chance to stop it- I get to say correctly that you have no cares whatsoever about your fellow Americans that are going to suffer GREATLY at the hands of Trump’s regime.
What I don’t understand is knowing this… you still do your best to rally people to either not vote, or vote third party
You put that on voters (of which there are millions) but nothing for the DNC or Biden? Maybe 20 people who could give voters what they want?
Why?
What we get are single-issue SJWs
Even while typing this, I know people would still do it...
But like, please don’t do that thing where because I didn’t list every little thing, that I’m saying the only issues with Biden are the ones I listed.
Single issue voters are not a really thing.
But when enough people unify under a common cause, progress can be made. Which is while everytime the common people band together, there's a couple telling them unity is bad, and they should always break apart and only worry about themselves.
MLK had some choice words about people that did that. Malcolm had more than words.
….. okay buddy.
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Now that we've had him for four years, and he was worse than we expected...
He far exceeded my expectations.
Everyone has different standards and expectations.
Hell, look at how many people say that about trump.
In which ways? motions to everything being crap
- Massive infrastructure bill
- Student loan forgiveness
- Marijuana rescheduling
There’s plenty more, but my expectation was for him to not be Trump which he has thoroughly succeeded at. The rest is icing.
The biggest things he’s disappointed on, Trump disappoints on too…:
- Palestine
- Being too fucking old
…so it’s easy to see how that on balance he has exceeded expectations…
Massive infrastructure bill that just funnels money to companies like Comcast and Spectrum and othet corporations who'll squander like they have every other time they've been given money
Student loan forgiveness that does nothing to change the insane and continually rising cost of attending college.
Marijuana rescheduling that does nothing to address the fact that 40 states have already legalized it for medical use and 25 states who've legalized it for recreational use.
This is little more than a bunch of empty gestures and lip service to make it seem like they're improving things when in reality, very little is changing (and to give people like you hollow talking points to list as accomplisments). This is why so many people don't even bother to vote anymore because the whole system is stacked against us.
That bar was extremely low huh?
Yes. Being better than Trump is a low bar.
Are you confused about what’s happening here?
It would be nice if we actually had policies we could champion instead of just "not Trump".
Marijuana rescheduling, infrastructure spending, student loan forgiveness, clean drinking water, lowered costs of generic drugs, expanded Medicaid, increased domestic manufacturing, rejoining the Paris agreement, increased nationwide gas mileage requirements, and improved healthcare access for veterans not enough policies for you?
edit 3 hours later...
return2ozma: "There are policies we can champion that are more than ‘not Trump.’"
Honestly, no, it's not. We should have had those things decades ago.
I've seen the need to point this out: Dems have had all 3 (of house, senate, presidency) for 4 years out of the last 24 years. If you include Bill Clinton that goes to 6 years of the last 32 years. Want to add Bush senior? Then it’s 6 years of the last 36 years. Want to add Reagan? Then it’s 6 years of the last 44 years. That's right, 6 years out of the last 44 years that Dems had control. And for filibuster proof majority they had 4 months of the last 44 years. Not years, 4 MONTHS of the last 44 fucking years.
And you want to ask why things haven't happened?
If you want progress, give Dems consistent and overwhelming victories.
This is like blaming Obama for his terrible response to Katrina.
I don't disagree, but that's a bit like a teenager telling their mother, "This meal is shit. I was hungry HOURS ago." Can we not be happy things are changing NOW? Is that somehow not allowed?
That should be the bare minimum. Crumbs.
The bar was Trump
It’s silly to downvote you for wanting the leaders and representatives of a country and its people to be held to a certain standard.
I mean, politicians work for us. We're their boss. They should be working their asses off for the people.
Frankly we should be sacking the whole lot of them for gross misconduct.
Now that we’ve had him for four years, and he was worse than we expected
Biden's much better than I expected, after being disappointed in Obama and his poor negotiating skills.