Mexico Has Fully Recognized the State of Palestine

I'm German. Can you guess which way the conversation turns if I dare to question Israeli politics?

That shits so disingenuous. Weirdly entitled to. Like what's wrong with the country you're in now and a citizen of? You were born here, why do you get a special secret super homeland? Why does that homeland have to be purely a Jewish homeland? Ya know come to think of it I can think of another group that really wanted a pure homeland for people of a single race... A master race.

Edit: Wrote this long ass message on my phone so expect errors. If you want I'd be happy to message further details tomorrow or continue discussion, but it's getting late now.

Well around the end of the 1900s a lot of Jews were having trouble in Europe because they generally weren't liked for a variety of discriminatory reasons. A group of somewhat radical Jews said fuck it, let's leave and go to where the Jews are said to come from and at the least we won't be persecuted by Europeans.

So they went and as more European Jews went a lot of non-European Jews began to go as well. At the time Palestine was a territory and the state that owned that territory eventually said it was ok if people want to move there.

In the 1920s Zionist Jews (not all of which were from Europe as many were also from the Middle East) accounted for ~11% of the population, but the general Arab sentiment was one of exclusion. During the early 1900s there were a variety of riots and revolts which seems to have mostly been by the larger Arab community against the Jews which resulted in the establishment of early Jewish militias which struck back.

Between the early 1920s and the late 1930s a number of these riots led to widespread massacres of the Jews by Arabs (there are so many individual events we could make a separate post). The Jews who remained got really really violent back.

The British government at the time spent a lot of time trying to make Arabs happy, get them to stop killing the Jews, get the Jews to stop killing the Arabs back, and the limit the immigration that was ongoing.

Eventually we get to 1936 and the first stage of the Arab Revolt which was against British control. The revolt sought Arab independence of Palestine and an end to Jewish immigration.

Eventually Great Britain was having enough of the situation and said we're out. They proposed the Peel Commission which proposed setting up two states, one for the Jews and one for the Arabs. In general the consensus is that the Jews either supported or were at least not against this plan. The Arabs on the other hand were vehemently against it and the revolt resumed in even greater force which lasted two years.

Finally Great Britain said fuck it, we're tired of this and these Jews don't want to leave (and to be frank they weren't crazy about having them return either). The Jews at this point were in active conflict with the Arabs at this point, religious leaders organizing people getting rounded up and murdered. The Jews stopped playing around and started doing crazy shit like blowing up markets and the like in relatiation (remember they are out numbered something like 9:1). Towards the end of the 1930s growing Nazi sentiments caused further migrations which led to the Jewish population rising to ~30% and the aid of British forces and foreign arms stopped the riots and turning the advantage to the Jews in combat.

After WW2 Britain really wanted out and for real this time, they tried to negotiate a split state and a peaceful withdrawal. It would have been a roughly 50/50 split that probably disproportionately favored the Jews (they only owned like 10% of the land prior to this). This was called the UN Partition Plan for Palestine. Neither side could agree so Great Britain just left. As this UN plan was being discussed Arab violence was starting to pick up, some buses full of Jews were bombed and a civil war broke out. On the last day of British control the Jews declared the state of Israel and the Arab Palestinians said oh no you don't. Israel was pretty much beating the Palestinian Arabs when suddenly the surrounding Arab states decided to invade Palestine. Some of the Jews were worried about wholesale slaughter (they had just gone through the Holocaust) and some Arab leaders were saying they were going to kill all the Jews.

Well, Israel won and quickly took over not just the part the partition plan would have given them, but also the Palestinian portion as well.

In the late 1960s there was another war between the Arab states and Israel which went much the same way as the previous one. Some state leaders were saying they would destroy all of Israel and the Palestinians thought that was a cool idea. Israel won and wasn't to happy with Palestine about this.

At some point Israel offered a one state system that would allow Palestinians to become citizens, but it was either difficult to complete (due to many missing records due to all the turmoil) or just outright rejection.

Eventually Palestine was allowed to elect it's own government (sort of) to operate within Palestine and Hamas won. Hamas is a terrorist organization that has the states goal of destroying Israel. Israel didn't like that.

People look at the Israel-Palestine situation and say Israel is wrong, but Israel is literally surrounded by countries who have it as their constitutional goal to destroy them. The Palestinians are being treated horribly, but looking back the violence was mostly begun by Palestinian leaders murdering Jews. When Israel has tried to give Palestine a break Palestine generally spits in their face and elects terrorist leaders. It'd be one thing if Palestine would tell it's neighbors to leave Israel alone and promise to stop declaring death to Israel, but whenever they get the chance the elect another terrorist.

I mean, that's not really what happened at all, though. Jews moved to Israel in droves after WW2, but it wasn't by any means given as a reparation to them. By and large, the west didn't support the initial Israeli state at all. Hell, even most of the generals leading the Jordanian armies that went to war against Israel in the 50s were British.

The only western country they would even sell them arms was Czechosovakia. The US didn't even really support Israel until they became a useful cold war tool.

The land was taken well before WWII. This goes back to WWI.

A combination of the Arab Uprising and British Empire's Egyptian Expeditionary Force drove the Ottoman Turks from the Levant. The Arabs expected to receive land for an Arab Kingdom, citing the McMahon-Hussein Correspondence. This fell through, as the French and British partitioned the Ottoman Empire according to the secret Sykes-Picot Agreement. This was seemingly an act of betrayal against the Arabs.

So Palestine was a British territory after WWI. And the British were sympathetic to the Zionist movement, leading to the Balfour Declaration of 1917 that supported a Jewish state in Palestine.

So as you can see, the plans for Israel were well underway before WWII.

look, I have just read a really detailed and depressing story of a holocaust survivor, who was 14 when the war ended, all her family dead, and nowhere to go considering how the polish and ukranians treated her during the war imagine even after a plethra of nations join forces to try and destroy you and all your family, you survive, only to be met with more hostile nations and the godamn british who liberated you you mean to say to me that person doesn't deserve a home after being forcefully kicked out of hers? and don't start about the arabs israel kicked out, they had somewhere to go, and weren't mass killed, or had a national identity, also it happend to a much lesser extent by a unorganized rougue, and (rightfully) angry militias who fought against hostile nations who wouldn't even try to compromise at all, it was rightfully fought and earned, no one "reperated" us with this land, they did all they could to prevent us from having it, but through hard work and extreme determination we still took it, to finally have a home after 2000 years of being persecuted so pleaee shut the fuck up.

Sheinbaum’s grandparents emigrated from Europe to Mexico – her father’s family from Lithuania in the 1920 and her mother’s family from Bulgaria in the 1940s. She was raised in a secular Jewish household.

I can't find anything on her stance on Israel.

Israel ≠ Judaism

I am allowed to hate a militaristic ethnostate oppressing people based on their religion and ethnicity while still liking the Religion they one-sidedly claim to represent.

This may be a bit far stretched, but:
In my Opinion, you further antisemitism.
By directly linking Israel and Judaism to each other, you make Judaism and Jews everywhere, a religion and its followers, responsible for the Actions of Israel, a Political Entity.

I really can't stress this enough: Israel ≠ Judaism.

This is exactly the Narrative that anti-Semites want to push. Taking the wrongdoings of a extremist religious state as an example why the whole religion is rotten

And lastly i want to make a thought Experiment with you:

If you were a Jew, would you leave your entire Live, everything you built, all the friends you have, behind you, just to go to some middle-eastern county, just because it is a religious state of your religion?
I certainly would not. And I'm sure most other people would not. The only People that would are religious fanatics.

And as such, it is unfair to all the normal Jews to make them responsible for what Israel, a Country where the religious fanatics and extremists go, does with its neighbours.

So i will ask you one last time: please don't link Judaism and Jews with what Israel does.
They are two completely separate entities.
I also wouldn't like to be made responsible for all the wrongdoings of the Pope.

Yeah I feel the same way. I feel the need to explain so much but really just can't be bothered

Lol supporting the poor ethnic group getting borderline exterminated by a western aligned and supported military fascist theocracy. Yeah. Super rasist towards the jews.

What a joke you and any other Isreal supporting nazis are

Yeah nazis. Fooking nazis through and through