U.S. put a hold on an ammunition shipment to Israel
U.S. put a hold on an ammunition shipment to Israel
The Biden administration last week put a hold on a shipment of U.S.-made ammunition to Israel, two Israeli officials told Axios.
Why it matters: It is the first time since the Oct. 7 attack that the U.S. has stopped a weapons shipment intended for the Israeli military. The incident raised serious concerns inside the Israeli government and sent officials scrambling to understand why the shipment was held, Israeli officials said. President Biden is facing sharp criticism among Americans who oppose his support of Israel. The administration in February asked Israel to provide assurances that U.S.-made weapons were being used by Israel Defense Forces in Gaza in accordance with international law. Israel provided a signed letter of assurances in March.
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We've been shipping Israel ammo to kill Palestinians for over half a year. We only now stopped one shipment. Think about that.
Best time to stop was yesterday, second best time is today.
We’ve been shipping Israel ammo to kill Palestinians for decades
If we accept this as a justification for continuing, we'll never stop.
It was initially for defense after a massacre when the Iron Dome was breached in October. That was completely justified support. The munitions sold since Netanyahu began indiscriminately killing Palestinians are not.
They've been indiscriminately killing Palestinians long before October.
They've been indiscriminately killing Palestinians long before October.
And during that very long time, Eisenhower, Johnson, Ford, Nixon, Regan, Clinton, both Bushes, Carter, Obama, Trump and until recently Biden didn’t stop selling Israel weapons.
And now Biden has started to cut them off.
Reagan held up arms shipments to Israel on multiple occasions.
He did not. He withheld all aid from Israel, and then provided military aid under the agreement that they’d use it to attack Hezbollah in Lebanon. That was after he sold the weapons to Iran in the Iran-Contra scandal that ended up in the hands of Hezbollah.
The man literally put this shit pot on the stove and started stirring. Do not glorify his actions in this conflict.
The previous attacks during the Biden administration were attempted attacks on Hamas, not attacks directed at Palestinians. If Israel always wanted to kill all Palestinians, that would’ve been done in 1985 when this conflict started. Netanyahu has been using the attack on Oct. 7 to justify the shift in tactics from targeting Hamas to “we can’t tell them apart.”
Hamas isn't even in the West Bank yet Shireen Abu Akleh was murdered there in 2022, while clearly marked as a journalist. There are so many incidents I could pull up as examples of indiscriminate killings but your ignorance is not worth my time.
I’m not saying the IDF didn’t kill Palestinians before Oct 7th. I’m saying they began targeting both Hamas and Palestinians alike after the attack.
Israel only came into existence following ethic cleansing committed against civilians in 1947-1948. Israel has targeted civilians its entire history.
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No, all the children shot during the March of Return were not Hamas, nor were the thousands killed before 2006.
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Palestinians have a right to resist. Israel, being an illegitimate settler apartheid state, has no such right. Attacks on Hamas are not justified.
Correct. The Great March of Return was during the Trump Administration. The thread commenter was talking about the last six months of munitions supplied to Israel. Maybe this is the start of change.
Blame fucking Trump for #1
American policy regarding Isreal is bipartisan stop shifting the blame and own up.
You say in a thread where the current president has delayed weapons delivery for the first time in 50 years. STFU
It's not because he personally wants to, go check what he's on the record as saying his entire career. This isn't something to applaud, this is him trying to avoid political blowback. You think we should stop applying pressure because of a single descision?
The other commenter didn't say that, but also, shouldn't we be pleased that a politician, the literal President of the United States, is buckling to public pressure here? Isn't that the whole point of democracy is that they are supposed to represent the will of the people? That he is doing this in spite of his own personal interest is pretty amazing and stark compared to Trump.
I think we should take wins like this seriously, the system is working as it should for a brief moment here. Progress takes time, let's celebrate how quickly an 81 year old man is changing course on something lol
Hard to celebrate anything with so much money stolen from the American people and so many Palestinians dead.
This is shameful and the fact that Trump is worse is no excuse, raise your expectations. There are ongoing protests being violently repressed and all Biden has to say about it is "law and order", wake up.
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I don't think it's possible to justify support for apartheid.
Agreed. It’s been the standard since Israel was conceived in 1948, but there are a lot more liberal people in Israel now. The ultra-orthodox make up only 13% now, and those are the conservatives that got Netanyahu into power. He only has a 15% approval rating since January, and there have been massive protests since March. Let’s hope they do the right thing with the next election and allow Palestinians access to their holy land.
Netanyahu's opposition are even more openly fascist. There is no meaningful left in Israel.
That sounds like ignorant nationalism. I have Israeli-American friends that describe the party very differently. I may believe you if you could substantiate it with proof of their fascist left wing.
The very fact that their "left" still wants an apartheid state! There's no Israeli left party that wants to give equal rights to Palestinians and return their homes.
They don’t. A large faction of Israel’s left wing believes in one-state. 20% of Israeli Jews believe in a one state solution, as do most Arab/Palestian Israelis. It’s been growing as time passes and the older generations die.
https://www.pcpsr.org/sites/default/files/Summary Report_ English_Joint Poll 24 Jan 2023.pdf
The trick here, that was even covered in that paper, is the difference between what Palestinians think a one state solution is and what Israelis think a one state solution is.
In that study they found the Palestinians viewed a single country with equal rights for all as a one state solution. The Israelis thought it meant a state with all of the territory but without the Palestinians.
Frankly, the liberal Israelis wouldn't be for a one state solution if it also meant giving up the land and property stolen from the Palestinians through terrorism.
"Scratch a liberal, and a fascist bleeds"
Watch how fast they'd turn right wing if property in west Jerusalem or east Jerusalem had to be given up.
Where do you see the point about Israelis believing it would be without Palestinians? I’ve read it twice now, and I don’t see that understanding anywhere. Did you make that up?
Figure 2 and figure 4 on page 7 and 8.
My description is definitely hyperbole, but it's still stretching the truth less then your 'leftist Jewish people really do want as a majority this thing that the study shows as single digit, or just barely double digit at 10%.' thing.
also, leftists don't want things stolen through terror.
This really reads as a cope study for American Jewish people that don't want to deal with the cognitive dissonance that the internal contradictions of leftism and Zionism automatically produces.
There is no ethical way to create a new homeland for a people that underwent a diaspora that is ethical when the land they want is already occupied.
Edit: plus it won't matter as long as the state of Israel has a law requiring Jewish Israelis maintain the majority population. Oh yeah, that's a thing.
Edit: this is done on a phone and I'm correcting autocorrect mistakes that don't change the point.
It was never justified and this didn't start that day
Correct. Killing Palestinians is not justified. What I wrote was providing defense to an ally that was just attacked is standard, and justified.
Nobody needs 2000lb bombs - which the US itself doesn't use because they blow up entire quarters and have massive collateral damage - for defense.
This is the equivalent of someone taking your house and throwing you in the basement and then when you come out and attack decades later they fight back and say its for self defense. Please.
So Native Americans should just start murdering Americans until they leave? One state is the only equitable solution at this point.
- I'm not against a one state solution
- Stolen land/property should be given back
- Your example is disanalgous, run the clock back to when the colonies were being formed. If a colonist from Europe came and took their house or the land they use or live on they have every right to fight back.
- If a colonist attacks me and kills my family I have a right to fight back. If I fight back then its not self defense for them but for me.
You’re right. It’s an imperfect analogy. The Jews that occupy Israel once lived in Israel. Colonialists never originated in America. If you want to run the clock back, take a real look at who is responsible for the creation of Israel.
The Jews didn’t have the means to fight anyone, having just been displaced from their homes in Germany and Poland. Truman and the UN, against Great Britain’s protest, provided the necessary forces as an investment against the colonial presence of Great Britain and socialist presence of the USSR in the form of Arab/Palestinian support. The US is more to blame for the creation and existence of the state of Israel than the Israelis.
https://digitalcommons.odu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1047&context=history_etds
The Zionist terrorist organizations that ethnically cleansed portions of Mandatory Palestine through murder sprees of civilians are responsible
Stop posting the thesis of a dude going for his masters degree in history at 'Old Dominion' university written in 1980 as a source when this was recent enough that we literally have primary sources for what happened.
Do you have a better source?
No one in Israel wants that.
Also, this comparison is very apt. Israelis explicitly want to get to the point where they have the land and can just give land acknowledgments. This view though is dependent on "Never Again'' meaning nothing.
20% of Israeli Jews and most Arab/Palestinian Israelis are in support of a one state solution, with numbers increasing as the older generations die off. Vilification of Israelis is no different than the dehumanization of Palestinians that you’re protesting. No group of people deserves simplification.
https://www.pcpsr.org/sites/default/files/Summary Report_ English_Joint Poll 24 Jan 2023.pdf
I edited my comment while you responded. That was not done maliciously.
I did the same after reading your edit. Lol
I thought most surveys showed like 30-40% of israelis were in support of a single-state solution?
That’s a two-state solution, and not really equitable to Palestinians.
So Native Americans should just start murdering Americans until they leave?
wellllll...
Oh they haven't waited in the basement for decades. This has been an ongoing thing since Israeli terrorists took control of the region in 1948.
These things take time, it’s shitty but this gives me hope that things might actually change.
Biden never had to start circumventing congress to sell weapons in the first place. His hands have never been tied here.
True, but hopefully he now realizes the error of his ways. Young people overwhelmingly do not support the US's support of Israel. He knows more about what is happening there than any of us do, and he was all for it until this possible shipment halt. Maybe he's finally realized that bibi has gone too far.
Pretty sure he just hopes everyone won't be paying attention when he resumes.
I am no friend of Bibi or the IDFs action towards Palestinians, but let’s be fair - the northern border has been lit up lately, and Biden is still a self described Zionist. Not ‘defending’ the Jewish state is going to be a big line in the sand for him
Seriously... When was the last time you talked to someone his age and changed their minds about something political?
This is part of the danger with a de facto gerontocracy, to be ruled by bad ideas that, with a patina of age, enjoy the status of tradition.