'Eco-friendly' paper and bamboo straws contain PFAS chemicals, study finds
'Eco-friendly' paper and bamboo straws contain PFAS chemicals, study finds
Researchers found low concentrations of so-called forever chemicals in various "eco-friendly" straws, raising doubts about whether they're an appropriate alternative.
Researchers found low concentrations of so-called forever chemicals in various "eco-friendly" straws, raising doubts about whether they're an appropriate alternative.
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Disposable products are gonna have problems to keep them cheap. The solution to straws is non-dispossble straws, always was.
Also this is still a silly topic, straws won't save the planet.
Or stop using straws all together. Cups/lids can be made differently, so they are more like a sippy cup. You don’t NEED straws. Humans are totally capable of drinking directly from a cup, even without a special lid.
Single use bendy straws were literally invented to help keep bedbound and other disabled people alive.
Which is the only legitimate use case, but I bet >99% of straws produced aren't used for that.
And you can buy bent straws in multiple materials, which are not intended to be disposable.
But no one is going to make straws to serve only 1% of the population. Accessibility features need to become mainstream (or forced into effect by the government) for it to actually benefit people with disabilities.
Everyone needs to use wheelchairs or wheelchair bound people can't benefit! What a silly argument. Costs will be higher, but the niche will be filled if it's needed.
Anyone can buy a wheelchair...
And wheelchair ramps were made legally required in many places.
Could be declared a medical product.
So US hospitals can charge $37 for a single straw?
No, no straws for anyone, and take away their special ramps too. It's all or nothing because that's the only way my argument works. Color spectrum, exceptions? All I see is black and white.
To be fair, drinks with ice in them are still miles easier to drink with a straw.
No doubt. But something with a smaller hole in it, like the newer Starbucks (I’m sorry I hate using them as an example) cold cups works fine with ice too. Hell, something shaped like the top of a soda can would do it, no more difficult to make than the straw accepting lids, and then no straws.
Those stsrbucks cups are fairly thick, like more than the amount of plastic in a straw thick. Is that really better overall?
Did you read what I said? I said I hate using Starbucks as an example. It just happened to be the first thing that came to mind, that everyone would know what I was talking about. Yes, Starbucks sucks, and so do their plastic products, BUT as I said, that STYLE is what I was talking about. In fact, I said something more like the top of a soda can would be good.
The style requires thicker plastic.
Not really. Everyone seems to forget we used to make things out of shit other than plastic for some reason.
They’re not difficult to make, but they do require more plastic. Probably about the same amount of additional plastic as a straw, really. It’s funny to me when people only consider part of the equation and not the whole thing.
As far as I’m concerned, plastic lids/cups should go away too. I’m simply pointing out that straws are useless, and if anyone cared enough, it would be pretty simple to resolve the straw issue.
Calling straws useless is a bit much. They’re usually excessive, but not useless. Ask your grandmother who can no longer drink from a glass properly. Or a quadriplegic.
There’s nuance in everything, my friend. You’d serve the world better to acknowledge it rather than speak in absolutes.
so, people who existed before the advent of the plastic straw just all died of dehydration? GTFO of here with that shit.
Yes, straws are convenient, and can be helpful to people with certain disabilities. However, that's a small subset of the population, and they can use reuasble straws, if they need them. Plastic/disposable straws are useless.
This isn’t even a fair argument. The subset of people I refer to who benefit from straws would have had a whole host of different things working against them pre-straws. Sort of a silly strawman because that’s not my point. I honestly think you just forgot to qualify a previous statement by emphasizing that you think plastic straws are useless and not all straws are useless. I was responding to your blanket statement that straws are useless.
I agree that disposable straws are useless, no disagreement there. It’s why I own metal ones. I disagree that straws themselves are useless. They are useful.
This comment thread is about disposable/plastic straws. I have been talking about getting rid of plastic/disposable straws in every comment. I never implied I was talking about reusable. I didn’t know I needed to be so pedantic.
Jesus man, ok. Let’s get pedantic about this. I’m sick, I’ve got time.
Parent comment of this thread is:
Disposable products are gonna have problems to keep them cheap. The solution to straws is non-dispossble straws, always was.
Also this is still a silly topic, straws won't save the planet.
So, on the table are both forms of straws. In fact, the immediate response to the parent comment leads with
Or stop using straws all together.
A few comments later you say
Straws are useless
To which I call you out and point out that they do, in fact, have a use. Instead of just conceding that they do have a use for a subset of the population, and aren’t totally useless, you pivot to disposable.
In context of this conversation, you absolutely need to qualify if you are talking about all straws or just disposable straws. That’s literally the conversation being had. You just seem to not like that someone pointed out a flaw to your logic. It’s fine to have someone offer different perspectives that cause you to refine your position. Nothing wrong with that. That was my whole point about acknowledging nuance.
You just replaced a straw with a lid.
cups already had lids
Not in the restaurants where straws are used.
Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but they already have plastic lids on them, which are bad, but no extra with my suggestion.
If it's in a paper/plastic cup you can pop the lid off and squeeze the cup to make a pitcher-like shape at the rim. Keeps the ice in and makes for easy drinking. I don't see why we can't just make all disposable lids like coffee cups, honestly. They even make ones that close to avoid spilling
I just bought like a dozen metal straws that are in rotation. Also, coffee cup lids require slightly more plastic to mold. You’re not really saving too much with that trade-off when you think about it. Metal straws work great.
I have some metal straws I keep in my car, I was speaking more to people who don't have or use them or forgot them and don't want to use a disposable straw. I agree that metal straws are the way to go. We honestly need to normalize and allow people to bring their own bottles/cups/whathaveyou into restaurants over disposable products. They should just charge a flat rate for beverages and call it a day. The profit margins on drinks are absurd so the restaurant will still be making plenty of money even if someone brings one of those huge 64 oz bottles in. They could even rig soda fountains to dispense pre-portioned amounts so that the restaurant maintains it's margins. That tech has been around for ages, I'm sure it would be easy to retrofit fountains that dont already have it
Woah woah woah, will someone please think of the cocaine users?
People have been using money forever, they’ll be fine.
That's gross. Paper straws are the way 🤌
Ivory for an extra dose of cruelty!
Quick edit: do not use paper straws for cocaine. Porous material will absorb your product. Also heat your surface before chopping, to make the product as fine as possible.
Stop making it complicated. Just line it up on someone's ass and get your nose down in it like god intended.
That one’s checked off my bucket list, and I cannot be more happy.
People carrying cash now are worrying.
(I'm kidding, though I don't carry much anymore. Enough for some gas or something if there's an emergency and my card doesn't work for whatever reason.)
Permanently Deleted
Straws are an accessibility need for some humans, not everyone is actually physically capable of drinking directly from a cup.
That’s fine, they can have their own non disposables for their own needs. We do NOT need to keep polluting the planet (yeah I know there are plenty of other ways we do it) with EVERYTHING being disposable.
Single use bendy straws were literally invented to help keep bedbound and other disabled people alive. There are also many reasons people can't use different alternatives.
You personally not using something, doesn't mean others don't, and to deny access to a literal lifeline for the sake of 0.003% of the plastics in the ocean (literally a drop in an ocean) because it makes you feel better and requires zero effort or sacrifice (from you), instead of actually acting to resolve the problem (like being anti-capitalist rather than just trying to apply band aids to its symptoms) is not only gross and ableist, but also a colossal counterproductive waste of time.
There is a lack of non-plastic materials that are suitable for every disability while also being affordable. This chart lists common problems with non-plastic straws for some people.
Complete plastic straw bans have a poor reward to risk ratio. It fixes almost nothing while putting some disabled people in danger. Just make it mandatory for restaurants and fast food to only give them out on request instead of by default and that will cut down on a huge portion of the straw waste while keeping them available for those who need them.
I'm not in disagreement regarding moving away from disposable goods, especially plastic based ones. Just trying to point out the problem isn't as cut and dry as you suggested. Straws are popular partly because they are more accessible so any solution that involves getting rid of them should take that need into account.
No, straw are popular because that’s what we have always been given, and people want convenience. Yeah, a small subset of people may need that assistance, but let’s not pretend that most people are being altruistic.
Costco food court lids come to mind. They have a hole near the side where you can either use a straw or drink directly.
I've never seen those in person, but after an image search, yeah, exactly. I only used starbucks as an example because they are everywhere, and most people have seen them before.
My mother is up there in age, every time she drinks from a cup she ends up spilling it on herself. Im not saying she NEEDS straws, but it sure makes it easier on her.
I wouldn't say that nobody ever should use straws, but there are definitely a lot of people who use straws even when it's not necessary, like when they're just sitting in a restaurant eating.
I can agree that having a straw is easier for takeaway eaten on the go or in the car too, for example.
How are you going to drink bubble tea without a straw?
I started making my own boba and I got a set of big glass boba straws.
Same way I already do, tear the plastic “lid” off and dump it down my throat.
I too enjoy gargling little black balls
How do you get pearls that are at the bottom of the cup? You drink the tea first and then use a spoon for pearls? Bubble tea requires a straw to properly enjoy. Otherwise you can't get a mixture of both tea and pearls.
Swirl the cup? You can get them evenly dispersed evenly pretty easily.
Have you ever had bubble tea?
Yes, I have, have you ever used your brain?
That’s an incredibly stupid suggestion.
Enjoy the deluge of balls.
Metal straws have gotten very popular in Taiwan, the home of bubble tea. It's not that inconvenient to take a metal straw or other reusable straw with you.
I'm not going to keep a metal straw on me for the odd time I want bubble tea.
People with hand or motor control issues very much cannot. And having readily available straws helps a lot with that.
I don't use straws. But I am glad that enough people do that it is almost never a problem... For people. Not the planet
So, your suggestion is to continue to kill the planet, because we might inconvenience a small subset of the population? I get it, I really do, it’s not fair for them, but those people can carry reusables if they need a straw.
So your suggestion is to let disabled people die because you can't be bothered to fight the actual problem and just want a feel-good campaign to take part in and to feel superior to others with?
At least be honest..No, as I have said in MULTIPLE other comments. Straws exist in other flavors than plastic or disposable. Non disposables also come in a variety of shapes. People can use those. Where did I say they shouldn’t have something they need.
Like I also said in another comment, people who “need” straws now all just died of dehydration before plastic/disposable straws existed?
I mean, people kind of did. That is how accessibility works. It reduces the burden on caregivers and makes it easier to live a somewhat normal life
Totally ignored his last point.
Slurpie with icecream would like a word
As I said, I hate using Starbucks as an example, but they have drinks that are roughly the same consistency, and they are fine to drink out of their newer lids sans straws.
No
Maybe they shouldn’t be cheap. Everything shouldn’t be a race to the bottom.
Capitalism is a race to the bottom.
I am a capitalist but by design it’s not a race to the bottom. It’s nothing more than someone putting capital up to create a business.
Improper regulations create a race to the bottom. Minimum wage, environmental laws, etc need to be in place and heavily enforced.
The Soviet Union was a communist country and they still had a race to the bottom mentality. Nuclear waste was just dumped into the environment
Improper regulations and enforcement of those regulations are the issue.
Capitalism resists regulation, and races to the bottom. Two people, providing identical goods and I'm direct competition, will race to compete on price. If one manages to skirt regulation and the other doesn't, the one who cheated will win.
This will compound on itself until it overtakes an entire economy, and that's where the US is now. Every corporate entity with the means to do so actively lobbying to defeat decades of proven regulation in the name of profit.
It may not be by design, but it is in practice.
That’s where voting becomes important.
Capitalism is the best system we have. Look at the good it’s done in the Nordic countries. It’s a proven and successful system.
We just need people to care enough to vote.
The Nordic countries are socialist.
Except that someone putting capital up is looking to maximize their return. Obviously they want more back than what they put in. Given endless greed, you have a feedback loop where they put less and less in while getting more and more back. Those improper regulations are caused by those same people paying to prevent regulations or to have those regulations work in their favor.
The Soviet Union was not a communist country because the means of production were not owned by the workers but instead by the state. The state being made up of a few privileged individuals who were the greedy bastards of that system.
Greed is inherent to humans. That isn't going to change. We need to hold our elected officials accountable for their actions.
Also you can't keep putting in less and less. Eventually the system breaks. You end up with nothing since it broke.
I think the hyper valuation of technology companies has become an issue due to the hyper wealth they have created. Typically I have no issue with people becoming wealthy but not we are hitting wealth that can truly change things. As such I support more regulation than I have in the past.
Greed is not inherent to humans, that's just a lie sold to you by the greedy. I'm happy with what I've got and I'm not looking to collect mansions, yachts, trips to space, etc. Most people are fine with a modest lot in life and don't relentlessly pursue unhealthy amounts of wealth. It's a sickness.
You can keep putting in less and less until the system breaks. This is what we're seeing now. Cracks manifest in the form of gross wealth inequality (i.e. massive power imbalance) and all the consequences that entails. These greedy sickos will push the system to the limit and give back as little as they can to maintain power.
That learned behavior. We have learned not to be overly greedy but it’s inherent in us.
It’s why communism always fails.
Now I don’t mind wealth but I do mind the crazy tech inequality because I think what they do with the wealth is harmful. I never had an issue with Elon till he went nuts on twitter. Zucker is doing weird things with his money and elections.
The wealthy use to build hospitals and libraries. Now they are mucking with core tenants of our republic and that I don’t agree with.
Pretending that your assertion is correct that communism always fails and that it's because of greed, that still doesn't mean greed is inherent in humans. All it takes is a few bad actors to ruin any system, if given enough power. Capitalism is failing right before our eyes due to this tiny minority of billionaires and capitalism had already failed due to a tiny minority of super wealthy in the past before it was rescued in response to mass protests that threatened revolution.
Speaking of salvaging terrible things, the wealthy used to build hospitals and libraries only as part of reputation laundering. They will do nothing unless they feel threatened. You're focusing on tech in particular, but it's a feature inherent in the ultra-wealthy. They will do only enough to save themselves and continue holding their position of power, otherwise they continue pushing limits.
It’s well known in psychology. Freud even spoke about it.
Capitalism isn’t failing at all. It’s working quite well. Not sure why you’d think it’s failing. We just have a blip with inflation due to the pandemic.
I focus on tech because the insane wealth difference. Few people have the wealth of tech.
Virtually everything Freud thought up has been debunked. He's influential in the field because he was early.
Capitalism is working quite well at its intended purpose of transferring wealth to the capitalists, but it's not working for everyone else. It's been an issue before the naked money-grabbing "inflation" of the pandemic, it's just become even more apparent now. The insane wealth difference was already insane prior, it's just gotten even more insane.
Capitalism hates regulations. Pick one.
Capitalism is an economic system. It doesn’t like or dislike anything.
It is owned and controlled by a handful.
No but the plastic ones actually did harm the plant.
Yes, but some people actually depend on them to live, and considering jut how little of the plastics they made up, the crusade to get rid of them is nothing but a superficial feel good endeavour that has absolutely zero impact on the crisis we face, and just leaves disabled people lacking access to a literal life line.
It can't have zero impact if you replace 50-300 million straws per day in de US alone. Could we do more? Of course we could but a start is a start and this is better than nothing.
Besides that I don't get how and why someone's life might depends on plastic straws but I'm sure we could find an alternative for that poor person.
We really need to change the way that consumers consume things. People need to stop acting entitled to everything they want immediately and with every convenience available.
Maybe people should start travelling around with their own straws. Have a craving for an iced coffee?? Well either bring your own metal/silicone reusable straw or deal with drinking straight from the cup. Be responsible and stop expecting corporations and government to solve every issue and maintain the lifestyle we have had the past few decades.
Things need to change in order for the world to get better, and maintaining the same level of convenience and consumption is unfortunately not something that we can afford.
Single use bendy straws were literally invented to help keep bedbound and other disabled people alive. There are also many reasons people can't use different alternatives.
You personally not using something, doesn't mean others don't, and to deny access to a literal lifeline for the sake of 0.003% of the plastics in the ocean (literally a drop in an ocean) because it makes you feel better and requires zero effort or sacrifice (from you), instead of actually acting to resolve the problem (like being anti-capitalist rather than just trying to apply band aids to its symptoms) is not only gross and ableist, but also a colossal counterproductive waste of time.
Yeah nah. Non disposable straws are just going to become disposable straws that take up more material and are more expensive. Just like the "reusable" plastic bags they use at the grocery store now.
Maybe but a metal or glass straw that got disposed has a very different impact on the environment than a plastic one...
