US Homes Face Costly Retrofits for Induction Stoves, EV Chargers | New homes in the US may not be “electrical ready” after an international standards agency excluded building electrification measures
US Homes Face Costly Retrofits for Induction Stoves, EV Chargers | New homes in the US may not be “electrical ready” after an international standards agency excluded building electrification measures
Remember that this was removed at the request of a industry group that strongly recommends all new homes have natural gas lines run to all appliances just in case some future homeowner might want them.
When we redid our kitchen I demanded induction. We had a shitty electric stove before, but I love my induction. It's be hard for me to go back to anything else.
Induction suffers a lot from a "people are really silly" problem. Every time I talk about how great it is, how much I love my induction stove, the person I'm talking to goes "BUT YOU HAVE TO BUY SPECIFIC POTS THO." As if it uses some rare special pot and you have to go out of your way for it, when the reality is that everything I owned and probably everything they owned works just fine.
I got a $5,000 estimate to get mine installed. Luckily we knew a guy who only requested beer and to not clean up the drywall
Letting a guy run a 240V line from a panel that might not be able to handle it for the price of a beer? You like to live dangerously.
More backstory they are an electrician and he has installed several chargers already. They were not intoxicated during the process, least as far as I can tell for drinking 2 bud lites for an hour+ of work
Coming as someone who did the same themselves, basically all mains wiring is good up to 600v in the US, and all main and sub panels have breakers precisely because you can overload them just by using a decent portion of your circuits to their fullest.
Putting in new circuits or plugs isn’t exactly uncommon or particularly difficult. The biggest thing to watch out for being the extra 20% safety margin the NEC requires on top of a circuits rated capacity that if I remember correctly puts you a gauge up from what the circuit itself requires, but if the state certified inspector signed off on it then it’s almost certainly good to go.
Do induction stoves use more power than electric stoves? I’m guessing this is more of a problem for gas stove to induction stove upgrades.
Here are the specs for Tesla’s recommended charging outlet 240V 50A: https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/downloads/universalmobileconnector_nema_14-50.pdf
Electric coil stoves and induction stoves use similar amounts of power. I think I've got my induction stove in a 240v 30A circuit.
The problem is that gas utilities bribe homebuilders to install gas appliances so as to create customers, and so the homebuilders don't want to install the electric wiring.
I saw this from Consumer Reports: https://www.consumerreports.org/appliances/cooktops/induction-vs-electric-cooktop-which-should-you-buy-a5820670446/
"...Because the heating process for induction is both faster and more precise, you end up saving on your energy bill. It won’t be a major difference, but given that an induction cooktop is about 5 to 10 percent more efficient than an electric smoothtop, it’s still a better choice for the planet. "
That's not a huge savings, which might be a consideration given the cost of induction cooktops versus electric resistance stoves.
I have tried two different induction hobs, and find them to be well powered and convenient to use. I'm still in the process of deciding on which one to replace my gas stove/oven. It's a chunk 'o change, so I want to be smart about spending it.
Here's another comparison from CR: https://www.consumerreports.org/appliances/ranges/pros-and-cons-of-induction-cooktops-and-ranges-a5854942923/
I saw this from Consumer Reports: https://www.consumerreports.org/appliances/cooktops/induction-vs-electric-cooktop-which-should-you-buy-a5820670446/
"...Because the heating process for induction is both faster and more precise, you end up saving on your energy bill. It won’t be a major difference, but given that an induction cooktop is about 5 to 10 percent more efficient than an electric smoothtop, it’s still a better choice for the planet. "
That's not a huge savings, which might be a consideration given the cost of induction cooktops versus electric resistance stoves.
I have tried two different induction hobs, and find them to be well powered and convenient to use. I'm still in the process of deciding on which one to replace my gas stove/oven. It's a chunk 'o change, so I want to be smart about spending it.
Are people just not aware that most natural gas appliances can be run with propane and not just the natural gas that utilities might provide? Usually just requires adjustment of the flow-rates on the appliance and fuel supply line. I forget which is which, but natural gas and propane run at two slightly different pressures, so if you don't adjust for that during the changeover, it won't burn as efficiently.
I mention this more as a "what would I do if I was told I had to sign up for the natural gas utility". Of course, this doesn't take into account that if you have natural gas coming to the house, you probably use that as your primary heatsource as well. So that's a consideration. In terms of kitchen appliances though, the info might be useful to someone.
The peak might be higher for induction.
Not in the US, so electrical grid is different but induction on boost can use much more wattage for short periods, triggering the breaker. In my case the circuit was 16A if I remember correctly while a powerful induction should be on 25A.
The new home I purchased has a gas stove. Instead of replacing it, we're planning to just buy a portable (pluggable) 1-plate induction cooktop as our primary cooking station, and use the gas stove for prolonged cooking like boiling rice/pasta or pressure cooking. It shouldn't be an issue to plug the induction cooktp into one of the outlets in the kitchen right?
Get an electric kettle, too. Boiling water on either a gas range or a standalone 110V induction hob is pretty slow, but can be jumpstarted in an electric kettle to spare a lot of headache.
As someone who cooks a lot, gas ranges just plain suck to use. Don't believe the astroturf. They take 20x more work to keep clean (which is honestly the only reason I need to hate them). They also heat pans super slowly (even my previous cheapo ceramic resistive electric range, which had a 5000W hob, heated pans faster than any gas range I've ever used), they irritate your eyes and fuck with your air quality (and thus require much more powerful vent hoods -- which are loud and also suck your climate controlled out), and they rapidly heat up the room you use them in.
Buy commercial if the hob is going to be your workhorse, though. The commercial ones are just built to a way higher standard compared to the cheapo import brands. They cost more and are ugly, but they will last you way longer. They tend to have things like powerful cooling fans -- which can be a bit noisy, but it protects their electronics.
I can't speak for your local energy prices, but I'd be surprised if the gas is so much cheaper than electric that it is worth using the gas range for things that are going to be powered for a long time.
Though they aren't readily-available yet, there's a new product category starting to appear that's more renter-friendly for this -- electric ranges with built-in batteries that run off regular 110VAC power. The prices are high, since you are also paying for a relatively large backup battery (that can run things like your fridge during a blackout, for example), but for many they are cheaper than the cost to have a 14/3 40A line run to the kitchen by an electrician.
Get an electric kettle, too
Yup, we definitely will. We also used to have one.
Buy commercial if the hob is going to be your workhorse
I'll definitely shop around.
but I’d be surprised if the gas is so much cheaper than electric that it is worth using the gas range for things that are going to be powered for a long time
I actually have to compare once we move in. The house has solar panels, so I need to test if it would be cheaper overall to use induction vs the gas stove, or use both depending on the type of cooking.
No issue. Those are specifically made for a standard outlet. They are just less powerful than a full induction stove top that’s hooked up to a 240V line.
Thanks, that's a good point. I used to live in a country that uses 220V as standard, so we could easily plug in stand-alone induction cooktops anywhere.
Right, assuming it's made for that. But it won't be anywhere near as powerful as a range. So it will work but not anywhere near as quickly.
My induction range required crazy thick wiring. 8 gauge, I think? Getting that done by an electrician cost more than the range itself.
It shouldn’t be an issue to plug the induction cooktup into one of the outlets in the kitchen right?
Just make sure it's the only thing powered on that circuit, since an induction hotplate can easily pull 1500 watts at full power. You could also get a 220v to 110v adapter and use the stove outlet for the induction hotplate, which should give you an isolated 20A circuit.
This is what I did. New induction stovetop for $5000 vs an induction cooktop for $50 that I can also take camping? Easy choice. We use the cooktop for a big toaster oven for everything, including pasta, so we only need to fire up the gas range if we absolutely need multiple burners or a ton of oven space.
Our cooktop heats up water just about as fast as our electric kettle, which was surprising to me. I guess they both probably pull the same amount of power from the wall.
Can't recommend an induction cooktop enough. We got a Nuwave PIC, but I'm sure any cooktop will provide a similar great experience. If you end up getting a PIC, I recommend getting the case with it. We passed it up, but we've taken it camping a few times now and the case would have helped. It totally blows our camp stove out of the water.
So if you have a gas stove, you might not have enough electric for an electric oven wired to your kitchen. Nothing new here. But for new construction, should you have to pay for that wiring if you're putting in gas?
Yes, because you're fairly likely to want to change out that gas stove — the homebuilders are bribed by the utilities to put them in.
100% yes. There's no future for natural gas long-term, so any home being built without support for electrified kitchen appliances is doing a disservice to the consumer. It's only a matter of time before the fossil gas death spiral starts and causes those prices to absolutely blow up. And frankly, given that electrical versions of modern appliances are universally better than their natural gas counterparts both in performance and lifecycle cost with perhaps with the exception of tankless water heaters or for people living in the near arctic, you're screwing over the average consumer by failing to do the electric right when it's relatively cheap to do it right during construction.
Even today in the still-relatively-early-days, electrification will save money for most homeowners. Building a new home that cannot be electrified just because the natural gas lobby wanted it that way is stupid. We have lots of building codes that are meant to keep houses future proof and that's what this is.
Here I am burning natural gas for several appliances in my home.
Just sold my induction stove for 65 euro.
A prior resident of my house ditched the electric oven for a gas stove. So I've got the juice, and it's on my list of appliances to replace... just not sure how to test the existing circuit without pulling the current stove to access the outlet. The breaker was off when we moved in, which could be precautionary. Or it could be why they replaced the stove to begin with.
Yeah, it's tough to test an outlet like that if it's blocked by a gas stove and you can't remove it easily.