Teary-eyed John Oliver begs reluctant voters to back Harris

Either Trump will win, or Harris will win. Choose one to help.

Clearly, obviously, Harris stands a better chance of helping Palestinians than does Trump.

harris being better is a low bar and i can't support the same system & people that genocided my ancestors out of existence in this country; especially after claiming to abhor it for decades once the trail of tears footnote/paragraph became standard in american history books.

i don't want to be a party to re-legitimizing genocide as acceptable political collateral damage, so i'm voting third party in a solidly blue state and doing so ensures that my vote could never support trump in any way thanks to the same electoral college that gives trump a chance of winning; i'm using the system against itself and i hope others do the same.
- Respectfully, what you wrote doesn't change the binary choice at play:
  
  Trump or Harris will become President no matter what you do.
  
  You could at least help my daughter, my mother, my sister by ensuring the one who supports women's rights gets elected? Who supports LGBTQ+? Who supports climate change initiatives? That's even pretending Harris is equally bad on Gaza or that things couldn't obviously get worse for Palestinians.
  
  Don’t be silly, those things don’t matter because reasons. But the genocide which we can’t directly control in any way? That is the only thing that truly matters.
  
  What's funny is their action here means they're condoning genocide in Ukraine.
  
  Leninists 100% unironically do. Though I'm sure they'll try to convince you that it's not a genocide somehow. Despite supporting it.
  
  They matter, they're also protected by numerous laters in various states. trump won't change that and I have an easier time taking up efforts here to counter anything he does do than I do for those in gaza.
  
  The only person that is at fault is harris for failing to listen to voice of her base; I suppose people like you as well. since apparently emailing and telling harris and your reps to cut it out was too difficult for many of you.
  
  You could at least help my daughter, my mother, my sister by ensuring the one who supports women’s rights gets elected? Who supports LGBTQ+? Who supports climate change initiatives? That’s even pretending Harris is equally bad on Gaza or that things couldn’t obviously get worse for Palestinians.
  
  every single one of my identities is targeted by project 2025 and i'm not afraid of it because i benefit from the experience of surviving the aids/hiv crisis in the 1980's. like it is in gaza right now; my government also did little more than make public displays of support while they idly let people die by the thousands back then and that experience has taught me how to recognize that they're doing it again. (it's easy to recognize it this time around since it's literally being done by mostly the same people).
  
  mutual aid was the only thing that helped anyone back then and we'll be going back to doing it again once we enact the few remaining parts of project 2025 that we haven't yet enacted since 1981. your daughter, your mother, your sister, my mother & my husband will not be (and was not) helped by anything trump or harris or any genocider does unless it's by accident and putting faith in them isn't going to help matters since they're clearly hellbent of repeating history.
  
  I'm glad you're willing to throw that all away, but you're also throwing it away for my family, too... So thanks, I guess...?
  
  And for what? To get Trump elected? You do understand mathematically you're supporting Trump's chances, correct?
  
  Let's also not forget that if Harris is complicit in genocide in Gaza, then you're not voting for Harris means you condone and are complicit on Russia's genocide in Ukraine.
  
  Edit: Bernie Sanders says the choice is clear; to vote for Harris despite Gaza.
  
  man you really like tokens. bernie doesn't speak for everyone. hes a great man, and hes 100% correct harris is a better option. but hes not a blungeon you can use to beat people with. she won't get votes from individuals like myself until she commits to stopping a genocide. if she loses thats her fault.
  
  she has known what she has needed to do for at least 6 months. every single one of you absolutely know what she needs to commit to publicly to secure those votes.
  
  you're just unwilling to do it. either because you support what israel is doing or your too panic stricken to pressure harris to do the right thing because you don't know how many voters are for what israel is doing; but you know exactly who you can target if she stays the course and loses. you're disgusting and craven individuals.
  
  i live in a solidly blue state and i'm voting third party. i could never help trump even if i wanted to because of the same electoral college that's helping him win; i'm using the system against itself, as you should do every chance you get.
  
  my ancestors where genocided out of existence in this country so i'm 100% sure that they would agree with me that being party to the same system & people that have a history of repeatedly using genocide as acceptable political collateral damage is a bad idea and anything good that comes from it is an accident.
  
  I hear this a lot but:
  
  I'd argue that driving up the support for Harris in the popular vote is critical. If Trump wins Electorally, it's still rhetorically important to stifle the notion of a mandate by not letting him get 50%.
  
  Blue states have fallen in the past or can shift purple if the line isn't held.
  
  That said, I'm glad you're not in a swing state at least.
  
  Reminder that it was Biden who just recently issued a forceful formal apology to the indigenous people of America. GOP didn't it. Trump mocked it by having a rally on their sacred grounds no less.
  
  Reminder that it was Biden who just recently issued a forceful formal apology to the indigenous people of America..
  
  it was another public display of the same "shallow understanding" from moderates that MLK jr wrote about; but i think he can be forgiven for it since the native americans in canada and united states seem to have similar understanding.
  
  and the blue states conversion is going to happen at the same rate as democrat's conversion into diet republicans.
  
  Yet for all of MLK's grievances, who ultimately provided the pathway to lawful change in Congress in 1964?
  
  waiting for election to end before taking action to stop a genocide sounds too much like the definition of that timetable MLK jr was referring to and voting for an genocider enabler to help maintain negative peace is something he actively warned against.
  
  moderates have a "shallow understanding" of MLK jr's efforts because americans are indoctrinated against all it of it except for his nonviolence and it's relevance along with my experience is saddening since i'm literally watching history repeat before my eyes as it's enabled by the overwhelming majority who never bothered to reach out past that indoctrination.
  
  So you're ignorant to what you're doing? Are you just acting like a lost kid or do you not realize trump winning will push the world closer to ww3. Stop bitching, honestly you are contributing to a real threat of the end of the world. Hold harris accountable after we defeat the nazis. The good guys shouldnt fight each other before the main threat is gone. Anyone who continues too isnt really a good person. You can die on your hill all you want, but dont drag others onto it.
  
  what will the good guys win if they fight together for a system that doesn't tolerate dissension and has a centuries long history of genocides as acceptable political collateral damage?
  
  Not being killed emtionlessly. Trump will allow the slaughter of people around the world and not just in the country you care about.
  
  that's literally what's happening right now and the people who could put a stop to it immediately, wont unless we vote for them.
  
  You’re a fool and arguing in bad faith. Desperate plea by Russia a day before the elections. My prediction is that your account, along with many others will magically go silent on these topics come next week.
  
  My prediction is that your account, along with many others will magically go silent on these topics come next week.
  
  i think you're right; but not in the time frame of your prediction.
  
  i've had to move from one social media platform onto another since the 1990's (before it was called social media) and it did so because of enshitification. the defederation-happy instances like .world are using their leverage to mold lemmy into a diet reddit and the lemmyverse will become enshitified because of it.
  
  when that happens, my account will go silent, as you predicted, and you'll be free to enjoy your echo chamber while supporting the enshitification of both the lemmyverse and the american empire.
- i’m using the system against itself and i hope others do the same.
  
  No. You're shooting yourself in the foot and hoping that somehow it'll make a difference. You want to make a difference? Get Harris in office for no other reason than to keep Trump out. Then, after the election, start working to get actual progressives who support your causes in office at all levels and work to support their campaigns starting at the primaries. You cannot beat the system by casting protest votes. You only hope is to beat it by subverting it from within. AOC and Bernie are proof that good, effective people can get in office. We need more of them in congress and state legislatures an governor's mansions if you want any hope of getting a president like them elected.

https://psychology-spot.com/basic-laws-of-human-stupidity/?origin=serp_auto

Doing anything else other than voting for Harris in this regard is firmly in the stupid category. Trump would be worse in this regard. You are not only hurting yourself but others as well.

Stupid people really don't like being called stupid, and in my experience, will be stupid harder just to show you.... Something!
- Lost cause anyway then. Fuck them.
  
  fun fact: we're more likely to fuck you for not behaving like decent human beings. 🤷 you live here too. next time learn to think less politically and more doing whats morally correct. its far easier and the outcomes tend to be better.
  
  If doing what’s morally correct is what you were doing, you wouldn’t have to take offense at my comment. Stupid ass reply.
  
  i didn't take offense. I just find you pathetic. 🤷
i live in a solidy blue state and voting third party so my vote could never support trump in any way thanks to the same electoral college that's helping trump to win; i'm using the system against itself as you should too whenever you have the chance.

i'm also sure that my ancestors would agree with me that being party to re-legitimizing genocide as acceptable political collateral damage and at the hands of the same system & people that genocided them out of existence in this country is a bad idea.
- Wanna guess the number of people that thought that same thing in 2016?
  
  wanna guess how much democrats learned from it in 2016?
  
  Obviously not nearly enough, since you’re literally repeating the same mistake.
  
  there's a meme from a protest sign floating around asking why it's easier to accept that hundreds of millions of people lazy rather than accepting that it's a few 100 people creating the problem.
  
  similarly, harris is one person and her changing her strategy will have a bigger impact than millions of people changing theirs to suit hers before the election and she doesn't even have to mean it:
  
  she could literally just pay lip service the day of the election where it can do the least amount of damage when it comes to moderate voters and that would gain the support of people like me; but she won't
  
  She has to take current strategy, because people like you are not voting, so in order to win she has to rely on votes of people that you don't agree with.
  
  i live in a solidly blue state and voting third party. i couldn't help trump win even if i wanted to because of the same electoral college that's helping him win; i'm using the system against itself and you should too every single chance you get.
  
  You keep saying that, as if the people with more sense who live around you excuse your poor decisionmaking.
  
  I voted third-party out of protest in 2016, in a solidly blue state, and it was one of the dumbest things I've ever done. I'd love to convince you somehow to not repeat the same mistake I did, but I can't say anything that others in this thread haven't already, and you seem very unwilling to listen to any of it.
  
  I’d love to convince you somehow to not repeat the same mistake I did, but I can’t say anything that others in this thread haven’t already, and you seem very unwilling to listen to any of it.
  
  you can convince me and people like bernie & obama have convinced me several times over the decades.
  
  present a new argument that's divorced from american popular indoctrination or give a new perspective that doesn't originate from american propaganda or; at a minimum; give a stronger argument than "trump is worse".
  
  and i keep saying that because people keep coming up w the same arguments.
  
  That the far left vote is fickle and that it's better to try to cater to Dick and Liz Chaney and hope for the solid neoconservative vote instead??
  
  Yeah, abstain from voting harder. Let's see where that gets ya. If you want to pull the party left, the. Prove to the party that there is a left they can pull to.
  
  Is accepting someone’s support with literally nothing in trade really “catering to” though?
  
  I mean the "trade" is just the implicit alignment of platform, really. Kamala offers stances that are not entirely disagreeable to moderate Republicans who feel more alienated by the neofascist shift the GOP has taken now.
  
  I wish Kamala was further to the left in general, but I can't confidently say she'd gain more leftist votes than she'd lose centrist votes.
  
  i live in a solidly blue state and voting third party. doing so guarantees that i could never help trump thanks to the same electoral college that gives trump a chance at winning; i'm using the system against itself and you should too whenever you have the chance.
  
  also republicans take direct action to work around issues that prevent their base from winning and democrats would benefit by taking similar actions; but don't since leftists platforms drive away campaign donors so it's a self made rock and a hard place for democrats.
  
  Oh, so are you pushing for a Senator or a Representative who can more seriously push the party left?
  
  i left the democrat fold after dadt & doma and the ensuing decades have proved to me that it was the right decision for my circumstances and i made it easy for myself by moving into a solidly blue state where my choices would be drowned out by the voting masses who generally align with my views most of the time.
  
  i will have to make decisions once the democrat's conversion into diet republicans starts to effect their palatability in my state and i'll have an answer to your question at that time.
  
  So you gave up on Democrats over a generation ago and expect them to try courting you as a potential voter now?
  
  Good luck with that.
  
  Edit: and both of the reasons you cite have since been overturned... by Democrats.
  
  i became twice bitten; thrice shy when i let bernie fool me into thinking that democrats could change in 2016 & 2020, so i don't think the democrats could ever successfully court me again; but they could court the millions of their most fervent base to help them win elections instead of driving them away while becoming diet republicans.
- What are you trying to accomplish by posting this stuff? What are you actually accomplishing by posting this stuff?
  
  experience has taught me that you can't change people's minds on anything and i don't think you can accomplish anything in this system unless you have enough money or sufficient collectivism to affect change.
  
  i'm old enough and am member to enough vulnerable minority groups to have experienced a few forms of enshitification and i'm sharing my experience because i can see it happening to both the lemmyverse and this country; if there's anything that can be accomplished by my efforts it would be the this.
- "Trump couldn't possibly win anyway, so I'm going to make a protest vote."
  
  Why does that sound so familiar?
  
  because people will forever fail to see the reasons why we're forced to vote in this manner if they continue to collectively make no attempt to look past their indoctrination.
  
  Wise words. Hopefully you read them.
- My my, the display of privilege and ignorance. Especially predictable from an ML domain.
- Then you should find someone in a swing state to vote swap with to get Harris a vote where it matters and keep Trump out.
  
  i saw that and i'm wondering how i can leverage it; it's a FANTASTIC idea!

We all know that she needs to do. They have the power.

Instead we're going to end up like the 2016 elections when there were these "Bernie or bust" voters that basically gave away the election to Donald Trump instead of voting for Hillary.

Except this time it'll be over Israel and their genocide.

What's even stupider is Trump would more than likely be worse in this regard.
- There's no need for "more than likely" in that sentence.
I was one of those Bernie guys but I learned my lesson after 2016, I voted for sleepy Joe and I already voted for Kamala.
So not only she didnt completely refuse to listen to them, she also repeated lies to their faces, brought Israeli family on the stage to speak about how they feel and refuse electoral Palestinian to speak. And now let Clinton say that Palestinian,” the people of the land”, have no right to exist.

How hard it is to say something along the line:

we will ensure children and women are protected

we will send x amount of aid of food and medicine

we will never support war crime

How hard it is to meet with Muslium or Arab or Palestinian, snd say something to make them trust her?

And then there are the other things that i found fucked up.

Screaming women rights and then letting Clinton, a known predator to endorse and speak in her event.
- How hard it is to meet with Muslium or Arab or Palestinian, snd say something to make them trust her?
  
  I don' t get this. Why promise something you are sure you can't commit to? Why desire for a politician to lie to you?? Politicians are already dragged for false promises on things they've actually tried (but failed) to accomplish. But you want them to whisper sweet nothings in your ear about an incredibly politically-complex issue...for what? I don't want her to say it unless she means to do it.
  
  So if her whole campaign was " ignore the genocide trump is bigger threat to the US" I will expect her to do everything in her power including lying because the alternative is worse than a genocide.
- I understand your point. But if you're American, will you vote for Harris? Or give away your vote to Trump?
  
  I will most likely either not vote, vote third party or vote harries.
i'm expecting another 2016 too and; just like now; people were telling her campaign that rejecting your most fervent supporters to court voters who equate kamala's relative flawlessness with trump's ineptitude doesn't get you votes.

the one silver lining in this upcoming cloud is that they're using all of my identities to virtue signal as it pertains to project 2025 and; if kamala loses; that will become a failed political wedge strategy and help ensure that it will never be employed again.

when we enact the few remaining parts of project 2025 that we haven't done yet since 1981; mutual aid is going to matter in a similar way that i experienced it during the aid/hiv crisis the last time our gov't did little except make a public show of support while idly sitting by and letting thousands of people die and i hope that the future's younger vulnerability minorities aren't so easily manipulated by those same people who cashed in on ensuring that they're minorities.
- that rejecting your most fervent supporters
  
  Is this also you?
  
  i left the democrat fold after dadt & doma and the ensuing decades have proved to me that it was the right decision
  
  Pick a lane dude.
  
  Is this also you?
  
  i left the democratic fold when they did dadt & doma.
  
  Pick a lane dude.
  
  i can't tell if you're willfully redirecting.

I was going to bury this lower in the thread but I think this deserves a top line reply.

she could literally just pay lip service the day of the election where it can do the least amount of damage when it comes to moderate voters and that would gain the support of people like me; but she won't

So let's make this perfectly clear for everyone else: this person would sacrifice the rights of women/people of color/lgbtq+ people, accelerate genocide in Gaza/Ukraine/elsewhere, and completely doom any action on climate change.. because they want lip service on an issue they don't actually care about. Wonder why that is?

No, kamala is willing to sacrifice those rights to commit a genocide. trump will impact almost none of those things without support from congress or full of military dictatorship. get your facts straight. no one did this but the DNC and kamala.
- Kamala Harris is not committing a genocide. If you don't vote against Trump, and he wins, don't think any of us will forget what side you're on.
  
  yes, she is. she has known about and abetted a genocide for the last year and has committed to allowing it to continue. you are also culpable since its clear at this point she won't change course. congrats.
  
  oh no, you won't forget I didn't support a genocide? oh dear. i'm horrified. maybe you should direct your anger at yourself first for not pressuring harris as I've been doing, and then harris next for being a monster who has been aiding and supporting a genocide for a year.
- Try telling that to the 18 year old who just died in Texas because Roe was overturned. If you want to try blaming Democrats for Gaza you're responsible for her, Gaza, Ukraine, and any lgbtq folks who die under trump because you decided your moral purity was more important than harm reduction.
  
  And what has biden admin done to resolve it? How will harris be different? That is a congressional/texas issue; not a presidential one. otherwise it would have been prevented by the biden admin. unless you think biden hasnt done anything because he wanted those individuals to die.
  
  learn to properly focus your efforts. if you want an abortion protection down ballot is far more important than harris.
- trump will impact almost none of those things without support from congress or full of military dictatorship
  
  Ahh so they're the same. Got it.
  
  Meanwhile you're carrying water for the candidate that everyone else with eyes and ears knows will be worse for Palestinians. But you want to call people trying to stop Trump enablers of genocide?
  
  And to top it all off, you idiots are pushing the Democratic Party to the right instead of pulling them left. Like that's going to help anything.

How nice it must be to go through life blaming everyone else for your own stupidity and bad decisions

ignorance truly is bliss and i envy you for it.
- How much more stupid can one person be? I too would envy those with any semblance of intelligence if I was you.
  
  i envy the intelligent who have the capacity to share their views without resorting to childish behavior; like your insults.

.ml moment

Man I'm so happy we can all agree we can ignore this class of people cause of their place of origin. It makes it so much easier to instantly be right.
- Wait were you born on a website?
  
  You are belittling and disregarding anything a group of people say because of an identifiable tag.
  
  You tell me what that looks like.
  
  Respond to their statement not on their appearance. I don't get why people think this is productive discourse. It's lazy segregation.
  
  You’re acting like having an account on a particular instance is an immutable part of your identity that you are born with. It takes less than a minute and zero money to stop associating with idiots and concern trolls.
  
  Also their statement has already been sufficiently responded to, unless you think there’s more to be added?
  
  And you are acting like a basic act of signing up for a site let's you stereotype people without consequence. It takes only you to not only use that identity piece to immediately treat people differently.
  
  And sure. Other people had a conversation. I'm just asking, what you added? Them not being like you doesn't make your response any different or more necessary.
  
  Ignoring .ml is easier than facing the reality that democrats are doing everything they can to throw the freeest election in world history.
  
  You’re acting like having an account on a particular instance is an immutable part of your identity that you are born with. It takes less than a minute and zero money to stop associating with idiots and concern trolls.
  
  Can you expand on what you mean by “the freest election in world history”? Are you saying there has been no voter suppression and disenfranchisement?

It's obviously just not a priority and blaming voters is both lazy and wrong. The Democratic party has shown itself to be a structurally racist institution where subservience to lobbyists is prioritized over victory.

No one asked for any kind of hyberbole from Harris. We simply wanted some kind of a signal that she would be willing to enforce US law (you know, as a prosecutor and as the component of our federal government whose literal job it is to do so) around the use of US arms. We asked for a few minutes on a stages so that we could make the case for why Muslim and Arab voters should stay committed to the Democratic party, and were denied. We could even be afforded lip service by this party, some cheap lies to hold us over, so here we are

There has been nothing gained by this Democratic parties pro-genocide position. But those who are truly to blame for it's maintenance are here. It's the apologists, who blame voters for not accepting the onerous positions in the limited times we get access to political power, who blame those among us who dare try and wield it. Those who defended Harris's position, and argued that you, the voter should be moved to a more moral wrong, rather than the candidate: they own the genocide of the Palestinian people now. Because they demanded we give up our one chance where we have access to power, Election Day, to accept little and less from a broken political system that capitalizes and your willingness to be disappointed.

It's no longer on Harris, dear apologists. This is your genocide now.