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Asklemmy @lemmy.ml
Yondoza @sh.itjust.works

How did we get so casual about conspiracy theories?

How did we get so casual about conspiracy theories?

I was talking with someone today about nutrition. This person has a PhD in material science. They mentioned eating beef daily and I asked about the cholesterol implications. The answer was about a vague 'they' wanted us to think that, but it wasn't true anymore.

I hear the vague 'they' so frequently now it's just a normal conversation. In truth, as soon as I hear the vague they I dismiss the speaker's credibility on the subject, but how did we get here? Vague they wanted us to think X is a valid counter argument by the most highly educated people in our society?

This sounds like more of a rant than a question, but I do truly want to know how this happened? Was it pop culture like the X Files that made conspiracy theories main stream? Was it social media? When will the vague they stop being an accepted explanation? Has it always been this way and I didn't notice?

Thanks, love you!

59 comments

  • Mk ultra, contra, sterilization of native American women and the intentional infection of African Americans, operation snow white, operation mocking bird, 5 eyes, the business plot, the ongoing business plot 2.0

    Uhhh that one room that's capturing the internet in real time, I forget it's name.

    False flags throughout history.

    • Actual conspiracies and manipulation (leading to probably most imperial wars of the 20th century till today)
    • A justified distrust in the government, who people identify readily as not defending their interests in the slightest
    • Conspiracy theories straight up cooked up by states to misdirect, or propagated heavily from media that are either state aligned or conveniently left unsanctioned
    • The manufacturing of a climate of anti-science (in the US specifically)

    Are the main reasons I can identify for why it's become such a norm. When things like MK Ultra, Cointelpro, Operation Gladio...etc are all declassified, the bar gets puts pretty fucking high for what states are willing and able to do.

  • Speak for yourself. Whenever I hear the vague "they" I ask who exactly that is supposed to be. Sometimes in earnest, sometimes I just sarcastically throw it back at them: They?

    But as far as I can I try to make sense of what people are trying to tell me.

    BTW a PhD does not protect one from being nuts, please perish the thought.

    In the case you mentioned I'd really like to know why they said it wasn't true anymore, in addition to who "they" are.

    • I do the same with "we". Someone will say something like "How did we get so casual about conspiracy theories?" and my first thought is "Who is 'we'? Do you have a mouse in your pocket?" because I personally don't feel like I am casual about conspiracy theories. It doesn't matter if that's accurate or not. When someone uses "we" like that, they are speaking for others in a way that might not be true and in my opinion that's a manipulative way to trick some people to think incorrectly and excludes the possibility that other people might think in a different way. I don't like when others speak on my behalf, I am not part of their "we" world.

  • Because the government keeps lying about extremely dangerous stuff to make 5 bucks profit.

    Case in point shell and otherd lobbying governments for decades to deny global warming.

    Microplastics are showing up everywhere because of products which were supposed to be safe.

    Israel controls half the Western governments not sure if it's still "antisemitic" to point that out

    • Israel doesn't control western governments, it's just a very valuable tool of the US, for which they are ready to make a lot of concessions. Western governments in turn are broadly servile to the US. I'm not sure how you expect a small broadly hated state like Israel to control the whole west. Lobby and intelligence can get you far, but not that far.

      • AIPAC: We control Western governments. These are our guys on the inside. We are spending tonnes of cash to oust anyone who is anti Israel! Look at us owning all these politicians!

        Enlightened Liberals: "no this is a strategic partnership"

        Listen up. What Israel is currently doing is speedrunning the reputation of the entire Western world into the ground so they can commit a genocide in front of the world in plain sight.

        You cannot in any way explain to me how this is a strategically sound plan nor offer any logical explanation except what the Israelis are screaming out loud themselves: Israel controls Western governments. Not the other way around.

  • The answer was about a vague ‘they’ wanted us to think that, but it wasn’t true anymore.

    I hear the vague ‘they’ so frequently now it’s just a normal conversation.

    If you want to know what “they” someone might be talking about, then ask them. Some conspiracies are very much real.

    Michael Parenti, 1996, Dirty Truths: Reflections on Politics, Media, Ideology, Conspiracy, Ethnic Life and Class Power:

    Almost as an article of faith, some individuals believe that conspiracies are either kooky fantasies or unimportant aberrations. To be sure, wacko conspiracy theories do exist. There are people who believe that the United States has been invaded by a secret United Nations army equipped with black helicopters, or that the country is secretly controlled by Jews or gays or feminists or black nationalists or communists or extraterrestrial aliens. But it does not logically follow that all conspiracies are imaginary.

    Conspiracy is a legitimate concept in law: the collusion of two or more people pursuing illegal means to effect some illegal or immoral end. People go to jail for committing conspiratorial acts. Conspiracies are a matter of public record, and some are of real political significance. The Watergate break-in was a conspiracy, as was the Watergate cover-up, which led to Nixon’s downfall. Iran-contra was a conspiracy of immense scope, much of it still uncovered. The savings and loan scandal was described by the Justice Department as “a thousand conspiracies of fraud, theft, and bribery,” the greatest financial crime in history.

    Often the term “conspiracy” is applied dismissively whenever one suggests that people who occupy positions of political and economic power are consciously dedicated to advancing their elite interests. Even when they openly profess their designs, there are those who deny that intent is involved. In 1994, the officers of the Federal Reserve announced they would pursue monetary policies designed to maintain a high level of unemployment in order to safeguard against “overheating” the economy. Like any creditor class, they preferred a deflationary course. When an acquaintance of mine mentioned this to friends, he was greeted skeptically, “Do you think the Fed bankers are deliberately trying to keep people unemployed?” In fact, not only did he think it, it was announced on the financial pages of the press. Still, his friends assumed he was imagining a conspiracy because he ascribed self-interested collusion to powerful people.

    At a World Affairs Council meeting in San Francisco, I remarked to a participant that U.S. leaders were pushing hard for the reinstatement of capitalism in the former communist countries. He said, “Do you really think they carry it to that level of conscious intent?” I pointed out it was not a conjecture on my part. They have repeatedly announced their commitment to seeing that “free-market reforms” are introduced in Eastern Europe. Their economic aid is channeled almost exclusively into the private sector. The same policy holds for the monies intended for other countries. Thus, as of the end of 1995, “more than $4.5 million U.S. aid to Haiti has been put on hold because the Aristide government has failed to make progress on a program to privatize state-owned companies” (New York Times 11/25/95).

    Those who suffer from conspiracy phobia are fond of saying: “Do you actually think there’s a group of people sitting around in a room plotting things?” For some reason that image is assumed to be so patently absurd as to invite only disclaimers. But where else would people of power get together – on park benches or carousels? Indeed, they meet in rooms: corporate boardrooms, Pentagon command rooms, at the Bohemian Grove, in the choice dining rooms at the best restaurants, resorts, hotels, and estates, in the many conference rooms at the White House, the NSA, the CIA, or wherever. And, yes, they consciously plot – though they call it “planning” and “strategizing” – and they do so in great secrecy, often resisting all efforts at public disclosure. No one confabulates and plans more than political and corporate elites and their hired specialists. To make the world safe for those who own it, politically active elements of the owning class have created a national security state that expends billions of dollars and enlists the efforts of vast numbers of people.

  • I think it's always been like this. I'm old as dirt, and I remember noticing the same thing in the 90s

    We desperately need to teach critical thinking skills and source evaluation

  • How did we get here? We've always been here. There have always been people warning about "they". Some portion of them have always been otherwise intelligent.Some portion of them have even been correct. This isn't a new phenomenon. It's easier for conspiracy theories to spread now, with the internet, and that's led to them being less fun and more dangerous, but it's mostly just the same shit.

59 comments