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So my wife and I have been trying to work through the practicality of me coming out. She's been having trouble perceiving me as female, which, like, I still have a beard, so I get it. She's bi, but also believes that homosexuality is a sin, so she's been trying to work though what we would look like. I've been trying to break apart the rigid gender roles a bit, and told her last night that I don't mind our kids calling me "dad" even if I go full fem, I have no problem with she/her/dad. Like, I'm the sperm donor, not the one who carried them for nine months. She thought that was great and asked about husband, because she really would rather have a husband than a wife. I told her that I'd really prefer wife, as husband is rather ick for me, so we are still working on that point.
Long preamble, sorry, but this morning as we were telling each other about our dreams last night and our visions for the future, she said "I envision myself in the future with my husband, and she's beautiful"
I think that's the first time I've been gendered correctly by my wife, and it feels so good. I think we are going to make it. I'm going to have my kayak and heat it too. I'll be able to transition without losing those closest to me. My vision of the future has never looked so bright, growing into old ladies together and showing people with our lives that "Queer Christians" is not an oxymoron.
Look OP I'm going to be blunt. If you want to keep your marriage, you are in for a long and potentially painful journey.
You will both have to work through breaking the indoctrination of hate caused by bad translations and the bigots who furthered it.
For example, despite being bi, your wife thinks homosexuality is a sin; however, homosexuality is only a sin to modern Christianity. The line in the bible everyone quotes as evidence of it being a sin is mistranslated. The line "it is a sin for a man to lie with a man" uses two different words for man in the original Hebrew, with that second version of man usually being translated elsewhere as 'boy'. meaning the phrase was never saying homosexuality was a sin, it was saying pedophilia was a sin.
I'm hoping for the best for you and your wife, but just be aware it is going to be tough. Coming out is a difficult enough journey when society isn't accepting, and it is significantly more difficult when your inner circle isn't 100% on board. Good luck, I'm hoping you can show the world you can keep your faith and your identity. ❤️
Yeah, my brother is one of the pastors at our church, and I came out to him on Easter, so this conversation has already started. I don't know if I'll be able to keep my church, I'm afraid I'll have to find a place that doesn't assume they have all the answers. But a "long and painful journey" has been my life so far, and both my wife and I are determined to make this work. This is progress, we are headed in the right direction, in the same direction. Feels good.
both my wife and I are determined to make this work.
That's huge. I'm happy for you.
Honestly OP I'm glad. You're right in that this is definitely good progress and apologies for not saying as much in my original reply!
Yeah, I really do not envy OP her Christianity; I'm so glad I was mostly over that phase of my life by the time I started examining my gender and realizing I wasn't just depressed, but dysphoric.
EDIT: To clarify, absolutely not saying Christianity (or any religion) is "just a phase" for everyone. Just that it certainly was for me, and I'm happy to be past it and to have partially dealt with the trauma from it.
I don't think it's accurate to say that זָכָר (zakar) is usually translated as "boy". It is generally translated as "male" and often clearly includes adult males.
Funny enough, all prohibitions are specific to men, even in the NT (arsenokoites).
💙 ❤️ 🤍 ❤️ 💙
Came here to say the same. I've seen other people claim Leviticus 18:22 was mistranslated, but all the actual Biblical scholarship and evidence I have found does not support this and the word is indeed a generic word for "male" that doesn't imply age. Would love to see evidence to the contrary, though!
However, there is a debate about what "Paul" (the author was probably not actually Paul) meant in the New Testament in Corinthians by malakoi ("soft") and arsenokoites ("man-bed") and some people argue this is about pederasty and not about homosexuality, and that is at least more plausible than the claims about Leviticus 18:22.
Of note perhaps to @June and OP: a documentary was also recently produced called 1946: The Mistranslation that Shifted Culture, which makes these kinds of arguments.
I stand corrected. :)
Like, I’m the sperm donor, not the one who carried them for nine months.
Neither of my moms birthed us and that doesn't make them any less of moms. And we don't even talk to the person who birthed us (we probably have talked to our formally anonymous sperm donor more recently and are on better terms with him). You shouldn't let irrelevant things make you feel like you are less of a mom. If its a compromise for your children, that seems like a good enough reason to accept "dad", but you shouldn't feel like you would be an imposter (or you should at least realize those feelings aren't rational).
Well, sometimes my oldest calls me Mom, just accidentally/out of habit, and it doesn't feel any better than Dad. So I don't think my dysphoria requires Mom, and it'll be easier for the kiddos as they won't have to adapt. We've been trying to chip at the gender norms and see what fits and what doesn't, as the wife and I are working this out. She/her/husband/dad might be where we end up so everyone can feel comfortable about where we are as a family.
For me, I personally reacted differently to different labels and pronouns as I transitioned. When I first started I didn't think my deadname or old pronouns bothered me at all, nor did I think they would in the future. It only took a few months for that to change.
In my opinion, early transition is not a time to make these kinds of promises, your intuitions might not be the same a year from now if you medically transition and live as a woman. You also aren't thinking about what it might be like for your children to call someone who looks and lives as a woman their "dad".
If possible, I think it would be wise to seek couple's counseling (ideally someone with a PhD who has experience working with couples where one of them is transitioning), not because anything you're doing is wrong but because it will give you a context for working through the active issues in your relationship. (Sometimes people see couple's counseling as something you do when you're failing, but in my experience if you are proactive and seek couple's counseling before the relationship has reached a critical point where it's too late and the relationship is ending, the counseling is more like an investment in the relationship that breathes life into it and can help sustain it.)
I wish you luck in your transition, I wish you lots of gender euphoria. ❤️
Glad to hear that. Just want to make sure you aren't being unkind to yourself.
hey sis that's great news!
I'm a manwife bearded woman nb mixup myself and my partner of 24 years is also taking it very well. Feels good! I like to wear skirts and am the stay at home mom but don't hate my boy bits and i'm happy to be as manly as she wants.
I wish you and your partner the absolute best :)