A Cuban teenager was offered a job doing 'construction work' in Russia. Instead he was sent to fight on the front lines in Ukraine.
A Cuban teenager was offered a job doing 'construction work' in Russia. Instead he was sent to fight on the front lines in Ukraine.
A 19-year-old Cuban accepted a job offer he received on WhatsApp to do construction work but ended up in the trenches in Ukraine, per Time.
A Cuban teenager unwittingly found himself on the front lines of the war in Ukraine after accepting a job offer he received on WhatsApp to do "construction work" for the Russian military, according to Time magazine.
Alex Vegas Díaz, 19, and a friend were taken to a military base, outfitted with weapons, and then sent to fight, according to Time, which reviewed social media footage posted by Vegas Díaz.
In one of the videos, dated August 31, which went viral, Vegas Díaz can be seen in a Russian hospital recovering from an unspecified illness. According to Time, he said he was due to be sent back to the front upon recovery.
From his hospital bed, he pleaded to "help get us out of here," adding: "What is happening in Ukraine is ugly—to see people with their heads open before you, to see how people are killed, feel the bombs falling next to you."
According to Time, Vegas Díaz said in one video: "There are dead Cubans, there are missing Cubans, and this is not going to end until the war is over."
He added: "We know that Cuba is aware and our advice to Cubans is not to come here. This is the craziest thing. Crazy. Don't do it."
Time reported that Vegas Díaz became part of a large operation that openly recruited hundreds of Cubans to join the Russian army to fight in Ukraine.
According to the magazine, the recruitment effort involved adverts for job contracts with the Ministry of Defence in Russia that began to appear on Cuban Facebook groups in June.
It said that recruits were offered 204,000 rubles, or $2,120 US dollars, to sign up.
Average monthly salaries in Cuba are dramatically lower, making it an enticing prospect.
Time reviewed the job contracts, which it said required a one-year commitment, but came with an enlistment fee and a payout for the families of recruits if they are killed in action.
The exact number of Cubans recruited through this initiative remains uncertain, with estimates provided to Time ranging from hundreds to more than a thousand
Though Cuba's foreign ministry described the recruitment effort as a "human trafficking network," four Cuba experts and former US officials expressed skepticism to Time
They said that the Cuban government, a long-standing ally of Russia, may be using such language to maintain the appearance of a neutral stance in the Ukraine conflict, Time reported.
Regardless of the nature or provenance of the recruitment drive, there is concern in the US that recruits such as Vegas Díaz may have been deceived into accepting job offers.
The State Department said in a statement provided to Time that "we are deeply concerned that young Cubans may have been deceived and recruited to fight for Russia in its brutal full-scale invasion of Ukraine, and we continue to monitor this situation closely."
The US State Department did not immediately respond to Insider's request for comment.
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Putin is not a Comrade and is just as bad if not worse than Bush. This is a war to secure resources, not a war to denazify Ukraine.
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Fr, bush did to Iraq, with bombs and white phosphorous, what liberals think Putin is doing to Ukraine right now
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Ring ring.
Torture: ✅
Indiscriminate bombing of civilian targets: ✅
Both have been going on for a while.
But I suppose you'll just plug your ears and close your eyes and tell me this is ProPaGanDa or some shit?
Oh and Bush is a fucking bastard, don't get me wrong. But so is Putin.
Ukraine Pre-war Population: ~40,000,000
Ukraine Civilian Deaths (from direct violence): ~10,000
Iraq Pre-war Population: ~25,000,000
Iraq Civilian Deaths (from direct violence): ~300,000
Even this is sadly disingenuous, as it was official US policy to destroy infrastructure. In a desert, that will kill a lot of people. That 300,000 really is closer to 1,000,000 if you include people that died from the lack of power and water.
So in other words it is happening in Ukraine despite the suggestion to the contrary by the person to whom I was responding.
Civilian deaths and torture are abhorrent no matter what country perpetrates them and no matter for what claimed reason they do so.
The point they were making, and I'm going to quote their post, and edit it so it is more clear, is this:
Ukraine Pre-war Population: ~40,000,000
Ukraine Civilian Deaths (from direct violence): ~10,000
Percentage of Civilian deaths to pre-war population: ~0.00025
Iraq Pre-war Population: ~25,000,000
Iraq Civilian Deaths (from direct violence): ~300,000
Percentage of Civilian deaths to pre-war population: ~0.012
I don't actually agree with those numbers that they are using, but I think they were trying to imply that there is a difference in the percentage. Which is to say the Iraq percentage is 48 times larger that the Ukrainian percentage.
The OP can correct me if I misspoke, or put words in their mouth.
The larger point here being not some whataboutism, but a counter-claim to Russia doing any such thing systematically. The deaths of civilians is always wrong but inevitable in war, but any claim that it's any more systematic in this war than in others needs to be able to reckon with this huge difference in scale. I don't believe the original person claiming this about Russia can achieve that
Now that is a clear claim and worth chewing on. Why ghost didn't say that idk. Appreciate you bringing up this point.
Hey you know youre actually sposed to show us the counterargument in your epic thread-killing retort, right?
hello! do you have a source for these claims, by chance? I would like to do some reading.
Torture
UN report - https://apnews.com/article/un-human-rights-torture-civilians-russia-ukraine-29e238cf0ec6a2e6a25bfd260bf5e93b
Another source for UN report - https://theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/27/un-russian-forces-tortured-executed-civilians-ukraine
Torture used by Russian forces in Ukraine may be state policy: UN https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/6/16/torture-used-by-russian-forces-in-ukraine-may-be-state-policy-un
Civilian targets
Putin targets Ukrainian civilians because he could in Syria https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2023/5/19/putin-targets-ukrainian-civilians-because-he-could-in-syria
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66781487
https://www.euronews.com/2023/06/01/terror-bombing-why-is-russia-targeting-civilians-in-ukraine
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/07/19/ukraine-russian-missile-strike-lviv-possible-war-crime
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/rcna63436
Russia-Ukraine updates: Drone attack ‘aimed at civilian sites’ https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2023/5/30/russia-ukraine-live-news-moscow-hit-by-rare-drone-attack
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/12/08/russia-attacks-ukraine-infrastructure-putin/
‘Senseless barbarism’: Russian missiles target Ukraine’s cities https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/12/29/russian-missile-barrage-targets-cities-across-ukraine
Thank you! I'll take a look through these when I get a chance away from work, I appreciate it!
No prob!
provide me with evidence so I can ignore it and reinforce my half-baked opinion in my echo chamber.
Have you even been following the war at all?! ive seen 4k videos of Russia bombing Ukrainian Civilians for months now, not Civilian Infrastructure,just straight up targeting Civilians. Im not trying to discount the hundreds of thousands of Civilians the United States has killed in the middle east, but if the war in Ukraine continues for as long as the war in Afghanistan did, it will easily be in the millions due to famine and starvation, because countless countries are already on the cusp of Famine from the war in Ukrainian wheat from reaching the middle east.
Millions. Iraq alone is estimated at around 1,000,000. Never mind how many people the weapons we ended up giving to ISIS under the program Operation Timber Sycamore killed. Or the amount of people that died in Yemen due to our support of a blockade, or the children in Iraq that starved to death due to our sanctions after the first war.
Stop downplaying the horror of what the US did in the middle east. You don't need to do that to criticize Russia.
Even if it was 2 million, that would pale in comparison to the amount of people who will die if the war in Ukraine lasts as long as the war in Iraq. Iraq exports oil. Ukraine exportz grain. People can live without cars and plastics. People can't live without food in their stomach.
An extremely conservative estimate is actually around 4 million. We will probably never know the true number (As is true of most wars, but America intentionally makes record keeping of civilian deaths caused by their actions to be very difficult to track.)
Yemen and Iraq import a vast majority of their food. It's a desert. They need to eat, too. Are their lives somehow less valuable then others?
I also seem to recall a grain export deal that was upheld by Russia. Your argument that you are using to justify minimizing what America did seems a bit disingenuous.
Edit: Typos fixed, and more context added to numbers of deaths.
Not Minimizing anything you said 1 million, i said even 2 million, then you say actually its 4 million stop minimizing what the USA did I'm not gonna engage with you anymore or next it will be 8 million and I'm Minimizing it by saying 4 million died.
1,000,000 in Iraq. 4 million in the middle east if you include Afghanistan, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, and Sudan. Those last two aren't in the middle east, but they also don't contribute too much to that number.
Millions. Iraq alone is estimated at around 1,000,000
is what I said.
I'm sorry that you have shitty reading comprehension skills. I'm starting to understand why US propaganda about the US wars in the middle east are so effective on you.
EDIT: Shit, I forgot that Libya is a part of the 4 million, and it isn't a part of the middle east, and it was a big part of that number. I still think it is a valid number to count all of the US's wars.
Have you even been following the war at all?! ive seen 4k videos of Russia bombing Ukrainian Civilians for months now
Russia has been extremely restrained in destroying Ukrainian infrastructure, especially in the first year of the war. It has also made strong efforts to avoid civilian casualties. Considering it wants to incorporate the zones where there is the greatest conflict into being part of the Russian Federation, it's not like this is surprising either. I'm sure this sounds shocking or ludicrous to someone who has been closely following along, and I do take your word for it that you have. But there is a very good reason for that. To explain:
I have also been following the war extremely closely since the beginning, including from countless telegram channels of people on the ground on both sides in addition to official outlets and what I've seen is a massive amount of ridiculous false propaganda spewing out of Ukraine's official outlets that the west eats up and repeats without question, often amplifying the false parts and making up even more. It is to the benefit of both the current Ukrainian rulers and the west to make this propaganda, so I'm not saying Ukraine is doing this to the west, I'm saying they're both complicit. Yes, I've seen plenty of propaganda from Russia too, obviously, but it is nowhere near the same scale or level of outright lying about what's actually happening on the ground, not because Russia is somehow above all that (it's definitely not) but because it has far less need for such false propaganda. (It is also arguably not as good at propaganda as the West which has the most developed propaganda apparatus in the history of humanity).
There is material reasons behind all of this. Ukraine relies almost entirely on NATO countries for its ability to wage war, this is not in question. It therefore needs to sell that war as not only just, but winnable - and whatever you you think of how just it is, it is definitely not winnable in terms of taking back the currently occupied regions let alone Crimea. That will simply never happen. NATO also has a vested interest in Ukraine winning this war, and in many ways is NATO's proxy war, so it also has an interest in pushing this propaganda on the people of its member nations. However, Russia has ramped up production of its war machine (and is highly self sufficient despite what some western propaganda might say about them having to fight with shovels lol) and importantly is not dependent on other countries to wage this war. It doesn't need to sell this war internationally and It doesn't even need to sell this war to the Russian populace who already broadly support it. Hence the large difference in amount and severity of false propaganda. If you have been following the war closely, but you have been relying entirely or mostly on Ukrainian, Western, and NATO information (which is understandable because it's really all you get offered in the west), you have been closely following a massively lopsided story being told to you by someone who isn't just distorting fact, but outright lying.
Since you specifically mentioned bombing of infrastructure, here is one example I just happened on in a different thread today. It's from the New York Times, which has been one of the cringiest large network liars throughout the conflict, but even here they are making an admission that what was claimed to be Russian attack was actually Ukraine itself. This happens all the time but usually admissions aren't made or are done very quietly so everyone believes the first story of "look at how horrible Russia is!" My suspicion is that admissions like these are starting to happen more often because there is beginning to be a shift in the narrative and propaganda as it becomes increasingly clear how unwinnable this is for Ukraine and NATO is beginning to look to pull support.
NYT: Evidence Suggests Ukrainian Missile Caused Market Tragedy
From their original article:
A Russian missile strike in Kostyantynivka that killed at least 17 and injured more than 30 others was one of the deadliest in months.
There are tons of other examples of this, but I don't currently have access to the laptop I saved all my sources on. Anyway, the reality is that you are being lied to constantly about the crimes Russia is supposedly committing, at the very least, the severity of them. And it's helpful to understand why.
I know I'll get called a Russian bot/shill for pointing these things out. Whatever. I have no love for Russia. Fuck Putin and the reactionary Russian government. But I really do despise the intensity of misinformation I've been witnessing and how it gets repeated by genuinely well-meaning people around me (I'm in the west too) who only have access to lies that are perpetuating death and human misery.
I bought chapo gold for this post.
You are, actively, in this post. Undeniable facts.
Or call me when Russians start kidnapping children like the Americans did in..oh wait that's unique to Russia
How about when America stops using rape as a tactic in war..oh shit they did that a century ago but we are STILL WAITING FIR RUSSIA TO ABANDON RAPE AS A WAR TACTIC.
Both invasions were wrong and each side had unique crimes BUT Russia is committing these crimes against humanity right now.
We set up a pipeline for kidnapping Cuban children: Operation Peter Pan (Because, of course it was named that)
Not saying anything about the Russian/Ukrainian war but you are literally pretending that America didn't do these things.
Also, America absolutely raped a bunch of people in Iraq/Afghanistan, and outsourced child rape to the Northern Alliance (Warlords that we absolutely set up during the USSR/Afghanistan war). We, in fact, ordered soldiers to not interfere with the child rape, while they guarded the people doing the raping.
Both invasions were wrong and each side had unique crimes BUT Russia is committing these crimes against humanity right now.
Let me fix that for you: Both invasions were wrong and have committed these crimes within the last 5 years.
You want to criticize these things? I'm right there with you. The second you only criticize enemies of the US State Department, then you've become nothing more than a nationalist propagandist.
Edit: Diction changes
While American soldiers absolutely rape and have raped people it is not the policy of the USA for then to do so and it is typically punished when evidence exists. The same is not true for Russia who is one of the few nations that does not address this.
and it is typically punished when evidence exists
Imagine thinking this
It was absolutely policy to
CW
rape prisoners in abu graib and Guantanamo bay
There is almost certainly black sites run by americans that are currently using sexual violence as a form of torture
Provide any proof of these claims. I will likely dismiss what you provide if you do, but I promise to give good reason and dive deep into the sources first
It might be quicker to show that there is such a policy in place or else a de facto tolerance of it.
But we all know none of this is written in policies, which is why I'm asking for any sort of proof of follow-up on the tens of thousands of cases by American soldiers. Or any proof of a policy which is upheld by the American government. I can probably point to some CIA documents about the topic from Abu ghraib or such as explicitly done. But the major problem is that this poster believes in such things as "policies" as existing outside of the material existence of the actions, which is a super liberal viewpoint and which communists need to learn to rebut. America also has "policies" about addressing homelessness but homelessness is endemic and worsening.
I also don't believe they can prove anything about Russian cases being more widespread or tolerated
I understand where you are coming from. Edit: I mean with regards to why you're asking for the proof as you did.
If you don't mind indulging my question...
believes in such things as "policies" as existing outside of the material existence of the actions, which is a super liberal viewpoint and which communists need to learn to rebut
I found this interesting.
Can you expound on the connection between "liberal viewpoint" and this idea of "policies being relevant despite evidence of actual actions to the contrary" (my summary).
I guess I'm trying to understand what makes this a liberal viewpoint or why do you classify it as such? Or is it a consequence of the undue trust given to governments with said policies?
I guess I am just trying to understand the viewpoints of my communist fellow humans here on Lemmy.
In my mind, I call their viewpoint naive and what I would term de facto policy is something that comes from observation and accompanying cynicism. Maybe that's an engineering viewpoint or more likely a viewpoint a typical infosec person like me holds lol. It's just looking at how the world is and believing actions > words...
In other words I don't ascribe my viewpoint or theirs to a political ideology. Though I could see how some ideologies might tend to influence such viewpoints. Does that make sense?
it is not the policy of the USA for then to do so and it is typically punished when evidence exists.
Cw: pedophilia, rape
Or call me when Russians start kidnapping children like the Americans did in..oh wait that's unique to Russia
If you plug your ears and say "lalala" you can ignore the mass kidnapping of vietnamese and cuban children. As well as refugee children that is still ongoing and is connected to pedophile rings.
How about when America stops using rape as a tactic in war..oh shit they did that a century ago
They literally are still raping US female soldiers at ridiculous rates. What do you think they do to women they've been trained to dehumanize?
folks, this is the nerd who claims fascist states are freer than socialist states
Above is a person who does not know what "democracy" means
No this is the person who claims that it is possible to be freer in one authoritarian state vs another authoritarian state.
For example the DPRK and Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge, whoch were ostensibly socialist, were less free societies than Chile under Pinochett which was fascist.
But nuance seems to be lost on the cult followers here because so many here are uneducated in political philosophy like you have proven.
Lol they cited articles from AP proving you wrong in the modlog
to the mods
Remember when Russia used their intelligence agency to kidnap 14,000 Cuban children and traffic them through catholic church adoption agencies?
Ah whoops, that was America doing operation Peter Pan in 1960. Of course Wikipedia frames it as totally a rescue and not CIA human trafficking bro, but of course there were loads of settled-out-of-court lawsuits for CSA by church officials and staff. The good guys, everyone!
That was also unacceptable but your whataboutism aside we are talking about what Russia is doing right now.
If your pronouns include "comrade" why are you defending Russia here?
You literally said this
Or call me when Russians start kidnapping children like the Americans did in..oh wait that's unique to Russia
And cried whataboutism when they pointed out you were wrong by bringing up what Americans did.
Its a knee jerk for them. They can't help it.
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The USA did not kidnap those kids. They were typically orphans as a result of the wars but hey don't ket nuance get in the way.
Russia is kidnapping children right now. Their parents and families still live.
The history of rape as a tactic is pretty well documented. You must be poorly educated in history to not know this. When Americans rape people they typically get tried whereas Russia just lets it happen. It's almost as if one society doesn't view it as evil as everyone else.
The official policy was to not be involved ij Bacha Bazi so if you have a source that is not laughable (like Medium.com would be or a fanzine would also be) that proves that Americans did not look the other way regarding this practice I'd like to see it.
The USA did not kidnap those kids. They were typically orphans as a result of the wars but hey don't ket nuance get in the way.
So if I shoot at random people on the street, and kill you, and decide your baby is cute and I want it. It's not kidnapping, because that was just an orphan bro, that baby's parents were dead.
Nah, if country A precipitates a war on Country B, people die, and then you started adopting their orphaned children out, back to County A, and not within their county of origin... That feels an awful lot like kidnapping. In fact, it feels an awful lot like the definition of genocide
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It feels weird to compare Putin to bush given the probable genocide going on. Murdering whole villages, raping babies, shipping kids back to Russia to brainwash them, forcing fake elections to annex territory, purposefully causing international crisis by limiting the export of food, and purposefully blowing up dams. Bush and Putin are incomparable.
Bush and Cheney deserves prison. Putin and his whole government deserve to see the world upside down for a brief time.
It's quite disingenuous to compare the worst atrocities committed by individuals, which were then tried and sentenced, to Russia's standard operation procedure and doctrine.
We used rape and sexual assault as an official interrogation method. The general in charge of Abu Ghraib, who as someone who would be in charge of those things is obviously a horrible person, was absolutely thrown under the bus by the Bush Administration to try and limit the explicitness that this was official US policy, but somewhat unsuccessfully. She was just a scapegoat.
In Afghanistan it was official policy that US soldiers had to guard the Northern Alliance warlords that we outsourced large parts of the war too as they would rape small boys. If they tried to interfere, they were officially reprimanded.
The US explicitly has used rape and sexual assault as part of its official doctrine.
This is just one of many examples. If it wasn't the president directly raping children then he definitely enabled it.
Here's what happened to the American soldiers who did that:
Green was discharged from the U.S. Army for mental instability before the crimes were known by his command, whereas Cortez, Barker, and Spielman were tried by a military court martial, convicted, and sentenced to decades in prison. Green was tried and convicted in a United States civilian court and sentenced to life in prison.
Russian soldiers in Ukraine are encouraged to commit rape. US soldiers in Iraq were sentenced to lengthy prison terms for committing rape.
The Iraq war was stupid shit based on lies. But the conduct of US soldiers and Russian soldiers is really freakin' different.
It's even worse: putin himself awarded the war criminals with medals, it's just utter shameless https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-war-putin-medals-bucha-b2060568.html
Citing “mass heroism and valour” but making no mention of Russia’s war in Ukraine, the decree Putin signed Monday awarded the 64th Motorised Infantry Brigade the honorary title of Guards.
💀
The Iraq war was stupid shit based on lies. But the conduct of US soldiers and Russian soldiers is really freakin’ different.
Speaks volumes about twisted freaks like you, who should be sentenced to life imprisonment. Calling genocide of over 1 million Iraqis "stupid shit" compared to probably like 1-2K civilian deaths caused by Russian army is remarkable amount of intellectual dishonesty.
No it is one of a handful of examples whereas Russia has NEVER abandoned rape as a war tactic.
Ok how many thousands of examples can you come up with in the US invasion of Iraq perpetrated by Americans. There are reports of thousands of rapes as Russia still utilizes rape as a war tactic and always have.
So not that much different from what America did in Iraq, got it!
Less rape, genocide and outright theft of appliances in America's invasion but yeah both were objectively fought to steal resources.
1 million is less than 5-10K, according to western mathematics.
I love how western lib fascists are always apologetic about actual mass genociders and terrorists, while faking genocides about their media trial enemies.
Maybe we need to stop assuming we're in a position to say what other people deserve
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Cool
You deserve the wall
Sure bub
Man I fuckin hate bush but you're too high on the borscht if you think he's comparable to Putin.
Manufacturing a war based on deceiving your population with hyper patriotic propaganda and out right lies is Manufacturing a war based on deceiving your population with hyper patriotic propaganda and out right lies 🤷♂️
Yeah, so far Bush is responsible for far more death.
I'm not sure what metric you would use to quantify how bad a person is, but the number of people they are responsible for killing seems like an okay one.
They are both fucking evil, and should be lined up against a wall.
Stop trying to rehabilitate Bush, and justifying the horror of the Iraq war. You don't need to do that to criticize Putin.
Bruh, never in my wildest dreams did I think comparing Bush to Putin in 2023 could be construed as me trying to rehabilitate bush's image, I'm literally 💀Lemmy be wilding out, I love it here.
My comment wasn't a reply to you, it was a reply to @Fantomas@lemmy.world (Unless that account is an alt of yours, and you forgot to change accounts before replying.)
However, the comment I responded to was this:
Man I fuckin hate bush but you’re too high on the borscht if you think he’s comparable to Putin.
Bush is easily responsible for more deaths. If you have a better metric for evil, I'd love to hear it.
Oh shit just realized that, I'm high as cake balls on some home made edibles I underestimated. My bad.
Goddamn, I'm envious. I was getting stoned every day to the point that it wasn't affecting me anymore. So I went cold turkey. It's been 28 days so far.
Dry vape, then combine with oil at 175F for 4 hours, filter, bake = super dank.
How about deaths per month? This war has "only" gone on for 16 months and probably there are already 500.000 dead and 1.5 million wounded...and that's not counting at least 20.000 dead civilians (>10% of inhabitants) just in Mariupol, at least 500.000 kidnapped children and at least 8 million refugees. If this war drags on for 20 years like Iraq at this intensity, are you sure it won't be 10 times worse?
Okay... But why should you use deaths per month instead of overall deaths?
Because we don't know how long this war is going to last and you're making comparisons with a short war+long counterinsurgency that ended...so it's hard to say more died in Iraq when you don't know how many are going to die plus refugees plus kidnappings in this.
It seems to me at least that this is a war to eradicate a people as evidenced by Russia targeting schools, abducting children and brutally killing civilians. Make no mistake, Putin intends to end Ukraine not just by annexing territory, but by erasing their entire history and cultural identity.
