Series: Conservatives of Lemmy: What do you think has gone awry in modern society and how might it be constructively addressed?

Conservatives, or people who would be considered conservative on Lemmy?

I was called "extremely right wing" the other day by a tankie, so I guess I can technically answer:

• Politicians pushing regressive legislation and talking points, instead of just letting people be who they are
• Conservatives who have no interest in conserving anything
• Extreme and growing wealth gaps
• Money in politics
• They never renewed Firefly
• They renewed Star Wars
• Fascists allowed to walk around unpunched

...yeah, as you can probably guess, I don't exactly consider myself a conservative. You need to define what you consider centrist in this context.

Can you define conservative?

I am right-leaning and voted republican until Obama. My beliefs haven’t changed, but as the tea party took over, the parties shifted, and now my vote is typically for a conservative democrat, as the republican party strays farther and farther right.

Well, we've become so tolerant, we've forgotten that somethings are just not good, and it's become taboo to talk about certain things.

Certain ideologies are just not compatible with western culture, specifically those who condone raping women and murdering lgbtq people. Ideologies are not races or ethnicity, they are not inherent to you like race is. Nazis are an ideology, so why give other ideologies a pass?

Furthermore, immigration hurts the average worker. A person born into a poorer country will usually work for less than a person born into a richer country. Immigrants are basically scabs, cheap abusable labor, and that's why we let in millions into western countries.

Canadians can't buy a house, the UK can't get a doctors appointment, Germany elected the nazis in, Italy came close to electing fascists, Sweden is the rape capitol of Europe, and America is close to electing Trump again, wages are down every where, purchasing power is down, everything is fucked.

We've let in so many in the name of tolerance it causes problems that we aren't even allowed to discuss, and it's destroying our countries.

I suppose I'm conservative according to lemmy, (I'm also not great at internet arguments, but do like conversation, so let's keep this nice.) Also, I'm not an expert, but I'd like to get the ball rolling here.

In my opinion, I think modern society is just more disrespectful. Social media makes the "shock and awe" approach the way to go to get views and get heard. Everyone is just pursuing their own "mic drop" moment. There's just so much noise.

So to get heard and stand out you have to get more extreme and entrench in your own views.

So how do we fix it?

In my mind, respect comes from better parenting. More time off from work for people does not necessarily mean more time with their own kids, but it certainly can't hurt. So maybe a reduction in the normal working week from 40 hours to maybe 35 would make a difference.

I'm not sure how we could make incentives to have people be better parents.

So I've always been left leaning. But I went to uni for economics so some of my left views I believe are best solved through the market, which appear right wing.

Also I have given up with current left parties for the moment so will probably vote right in the next election.

I think more things need to be nationalised, like rail and water, need more money for schools and hospitals and the police (somehow that's a right wing view on this website unbelievably everything short of communism seems right wing in this place.)

But largely I think we need more money in the hands of people, more taxes and value needs to be more accurately addressed (externalities).

The belief coming forward in economics is money beats everything. Poor people don't have enough food? Don't give them free food give them cash, it's better for them and cheaper for the state. So eventually UBI needs to exist but cash transfers are the way for people that need help.

Things that pay back in 20 years should be focused on. Subsidised nurseries and free things for teenagers to do.

Rail adds value to the area directly around it so rail is subsidised by a Land value tax on the wealth it creates around it. (Japan does this sort of, they own land around stations). Land value tax in general is great.

This is all going to cost money and people ultimately need to pay for it. So people will have less wealth but if you can free up costs then it can be a win win. More for the state and more for the people. So let's solve the housing crisis and wage stagnation. Immigration! That's why I'm voting right wing. Unskilled labour keeps wages down and house prices up, it's as simple as that. The capitalist win and that's why they try to gaslight everyone into thinking bringing in people that contribute less to the economy and commit more crime than locals is a good thing. (Stats are out there. Some countries absolutely don't do this, some do. A lot is lost in averages but some demographics make the country worse some obviously better).

Personally I'd demolish a lot of low density land and build more houses (privately) downtown and link it with public transport.

We work too much and we need to start reducing the working hours and put more money into reeducation. I'd probably give tax discounts to business that set up outside of the main cities too.

On a personal societal level we have also lost sight of what equality actually is. Equality isn't treating people differently because they are different, it's treating people the same even if they are different.

You're not going to find these kind of conservatives on Lemmy.

I consider myself a centrist libertarian but I often feel like the most conservative one in the room around here. I think America needs electoral reform to allow more viable parties - having no viable alternatives is terrible for voters and leaves them few options if lunatics take over their party. It's too easy for special interests (mostly industry groups) to use the government to obtain special benefits or protection from competition for themselves, with the costs widely spread across society, making it difficult to organize opposition to them. This should be someone's (or a handful of someones') job! An ombudsman or small panel of them, something like that. The government should not be paying off or guaranteeing student loans when people decide to study things that don't lead to careers. If someone wants to get a grad degree in rich people's hobbies or political activism that's their first amendment right but it's a waste of taxpayer dollars. We need at least a plan to allocate limited resources including but not limited to road capacity, ideally with markets. Everyone sitting in traffic and suffering is not a good solution.

The truth is that nobody ever really cared about anyone else, but social norms kept people in line and slow communications made it hard to organize. The internet taught everyone that they're always right, and it's ok to argue about anything and everything with as mich vitriol as one could muster. It also allowed the worst among us to organize and communicate easily. COVID showed us how much people truly don't give a shit about almost everything until it's truly a disaster for them personally.

The biggest problem by far in my opinion is the "political correctness" and the one-sided discussions. Everyone just wants to circle jerk in their own bubble. Be it left or be it right. Both have the same problem and both keep banning the other and escaping to new social media bubbles in the process (e.g., truth-social).

Lemmy tends to be rather left-wing, at least most mods are. I tend to be a bit more right. I'm not racist, not against lgbtq and not insulting anyone personally. Yet, whenever it's about politics, I have to be very careful how I voice my opinion because the moment I'm disagreeing with any of the mods on the slightest, most irrelevant neuance, I'm being banned or the comment deleted. Everyone is just immediately judgy if you don't say it exactly as you mean it. This is really hard and annoying for me as a non-native speaker. This has not always been like this eventhough my views haven't changed at all. It's getting more extreme recently and I'm getting tired of it almost to the point of leaving Lemmy. We're seing new social medias like truth-social form for that exact reason. And this kills the internet and it kills political discourse!

The solution: hear EVERYONE out. EVERYONE. Only remove obvious bots and propandists from certain countries from the equation. You can easily filter these two out by just looking at their profile history. You're allowed to downvote (that's what the button is for). You can reply. If you feel insulted, tell them or insult back. Don't be a man-baby and bitch about everything you disagree and stand your ground! If you don't want anyone to radicalize, this is the only solution. We need every spectrum here. Everyone except for the bots!

Lemmy's loudest seem to believe me thinking the "democratic" part of "democratic socialism" is pretty important makes me a conservative. So here's my "manifesto" for what needs to change in this country, not even to fix our problems but to give us the tools we'll need to finally finish cleaning up this inherited mess that's been made in this land for over 400 years now.

• Abolish the independent executive, inherently the body will become a parasitic leach upon the powers and responsibilities of the legislature until we get Caesar types running for the office just for the immunity to prosecution. Rome reserved that much power entrusted to a single person for ABSOLUTE EMERGENCIES for a reason, and the only two men in US history I think have ever actually needed that level of power were Lincoln and FDR.

• Delegate the responsibilities of government to a vastly expanded parliamentary house

• Delegate the responsibilities of state to a vastly expanded senate (still equal number of senators it's just now you elect a handful at a time every two years instead of one every two or four)

• Multi-Seat STAR voting to fill the house and senate, every election will see every voting district/state send a delegation which roughly reflects the political cross section in each district and state, even Wyoming would send at least one democrat, and that fact that everyone would have at least one senator or representative who they feel validates their issues and concerns and hears their position will I think let a significant amount of steam off the building frustrations people have with their government. Plus these vastly expanded bodies will naturally end up being host to more people who previously had been kept out of the halls of power, more accessibility in terms of women, PoC, and Queer folks getting into office sure, but also, people who aren't any of those things, but who also have been kept out of the discussion because they're too poor to meaningfully challenge the established incumbents. It'll also make lobbying WAAAY harder since you have to spread a massive amount of dough to make any differences at such a grand scale.

• Replace the current circuit system of the federal court with a sortitionate system that draws the judges randomly from across the entire pool of federal judges to try cases with federal jurisdiction. Court stacking and jurisdiction shopping both are too easy at present and both wildly undermine the idea of blind justice, so let the lawyers focus on putting a case together that can win in front of any judge instead of just choosing the judge that'll say yes to them.

Again, none of this will fix all our problems, it won't fix anything except our inability to get out of our own way when trying to solve the problems we face as a country, but goddamn is even that much desperately needed in this land made for you and me.

American society is too individualistic and needs a greater focus on family, including multigenerational households.

We have a duty to limit oppression of people whereever they maybe. "Culture" is no excuse to justify it. The "sovereignty" of a tin pot dictator doesn't justify it. War is worse then hell, because hell doesn't have innocents in it to suffer. It is the last option after all else has failed, but it is an option and better than allowing liberty to be snuffed out.

I would not consider my self a "conservative" and definatly don't associate with all the baggage that come with the word now, but I don't consider myself republican or democratic either. Some can probably sort me in to a category, and thats okay, have fun.

I will support everyone living their best life as long as it doesn't disrupt others from living their life. Overall I try to support policy that will benefit society and indivules as whole while respecting individuals freedoms.

Here's some hot takes that will probably upset all kinds of people. These are poorly witten generalization of what goes on in my head. I do try to keep open mindied to other opinions and perspectives.

• LGBTQ+ - I fully support you, 99% of you are great, but the 1% on scocial media needs to stop throwing a tantrum whenever a stranger mistakenly misgenders you. It makes the 99% look bad. (hartasment/bulling not okay - If some jerk insists on calling someone who appears to have fully transitioned the wrong pronouns, after being asked to use the correct one - fuck em, they're no better than racits and scum of society.)
• Letting children transition? This one is much more nuanced, personally I belive letting a child dress/behave (I know theres more to it than that) in any fashion they like is absolutly okay. Putting them through various medical procedures/treatment like puperty blockers is an act I do not belive in due to some major (rare) side effects. Asking a 11 year old if they want to risk never having a child is absolutly insane to me. On the flip side, I do recognize the fact that pre-puberty is, medically speaking, the best time make the transtsion.

• guns? Don't care, but treat them with respect and don't blame the gun for muder. If you have a violent history - no gun for you. If you're the type to pull out your gun to show your daughter's BF how tough you are - no gun for you. If you the type to wave it out your car window when someone upsets you - no gun or drivers lincess for you. If you don't keep it locked up/secured at all times - no gun for you. If you make a gun safe that can be opened with a spoon (LPL) - prison for you.

• ProLife/Choice - I'm personally pro-choice, but belive there's got to be a limit, maybe after 6 months in its too late unless it's medical or result of rape or something. Abortion clinics need to be seriously overhauled and properly avalible across the nation and regulated like any other medical facitly.

• On the flip side, take a serious look at why individuals are choosing abortion over having children. Is it the economic burden, lost hope for the future, poor access to brith-control, poor education about birth control?

• police - needs serious work. While most are okay, the bad ones get away with some terrifying life-destroying shit and it makes the rest look terrible. A law-abiding citizen should not fear the police, that's is 3rd world dictator shit.

• Corporations - need some serious regulations that basically say "if the government can't infringe on citizens rights (privacy) neither can you".

• • stop making the fines for these big coportaions cheaper than doing the crime
• • who tf let Microsoft buy all those game companies in an obvious antitrust violation?
• • Ownership - when I buy something it is mine. If I buy access to a movie through service X, I have baught it. If service X shuts down, my access should be transfered (download perfered) at no cost to me.
• • Terms and conditions - if they change after purchase, I should be entitled to a full refund if I disagree. You can't abritaritly change a contract. Forced arbitration should be illeagle.

• labor laws - mandatory holiday/vacation pay for all, even part time. Cut out the " tipped wage" bullshit. Find some way to raise wages without business needing to jack prices so high the new wages are worthless.

• Drugs/Weed - again do as you please but treat it like alcohol. DUIs should be treated as major crime - they are operating a death box and not treating it as such.

• Institutionalized gamabling/lotteries - go away. Its the poor people who get sucked in the worst, we don't need people dumping the last of their money into slot machines and scratch off cards. Things like games of skill that can result in a prize, a raffel for charity or playing privately with a group of friends are all fine with me.

• Healthcare/Insurance - step one is to make it so insurance isn't the one deciding what to cover. The ones making profit when they don't pay should not be the ones making the decision.

• • Step two - universal coverage: everyone's covered for life threatening emergencies and related medicine needs. Everyone's covered for 1 head to toe physical a year (that includes basic vision and hearing tests). 2 dentist visits a year. Everyone's covered for 2 therapy sessions a year. That alone should be good for most heathy people. If you need more coverage then you start paying a bit more. Any voluntary procedures, I.e cosmetic - not resultant of an injury or medical condition - will not be covered by default.
• • • Militay vets and first responders have full coverage for life as a thank you for putting your body at risk for others. Any one in an executive or political postion making more than $500,000 a year in personal profits gets 0 coverage as a fuck you for hoarding your money.
• • Step 3 - no "in network" doctor bullshit. If they are a licensed doctor at a legimatly accredited/licensed? medical facility then they are okay. If insurances find that they have repeated issues with a person/place, they needs to be investigated and probably shut down.

• public education - boy what a underfunded mess it has become. Besides fearing for their lives, children are essentially being taught for one goal - pay into the college debt nightmare or go get a job as a garbage man. While an exaggeration and oversimplification, depending on where you go kids are being tested on high level collage literature (and all failing and made to feel like shit about it) or missing out on basic facts (yes the Earth only has moon, 5G towers won't spread disease and Europe is not country.)

• rioters disguised as protestors - arrest/fine them. I'm sorry, but destroying random people's property or harming people (even if they are police) is not okay. They need to be held accountable for their crimes. At the same time, violent maniacs disguised as "peace officers" or something is also not okay. Peacefullly protest, find ways to inform unrelated parties of your problems with out disrupting their lives. While maybe not as effevtive, don't make your self the bad guy - no will support you. Those oil protestors who sit in traffic need to be run over. All they're doing is holding up traffic, creating a ton more of the exact emissions,wasting peoples gas, time, holding up emergency vehicles or some doctor headed to preform emergency surgery. Imagine if your kid dies because Doc McMiracle got held up by protestors preaching about leaving a healthy planet for our children...

Hi there, I'd like to share my viewpoint.

(let me say up first that I'm not a conservative, not in the US, but still try to give good-faith understandings)

So I think a major pain point for conservatives in the US is that the traditional lifestyle (being a farmer, traditional family, ...) are harder to uptain today than they were in the past.

Another issue is that conservatives don't like that their children are being taught non-conservatives viewpoints in schools. Consider: how would you like it if your children are required to go to school by law, but then the schools don't teach them "your" way of life, but a totally different one. It makes you angry.

Multiple conflicting definitions for "Conservative", for 1 thing..

WHEN you tolerate the:

• moneyarchists
• legalists
• class-position worshippers / monarchists
• authority-worshippers

to claim that they define conservatism,

& us who're committed to conserving

• G-D given LivingValidity
• G-D given LivingWorth
• G-D given LivingPotential
• G-D offered LivingOpportunity

.. people are therefore defined to be not "conservative"..

then the framing has been highjacked.

Integrity-conservatives are conservatives.

LivingPotential conservatives are conservatives, who're interested in competent education for all, instead of accommodating the obliteration of LivingPotential through shit "education"..

LivingOpportunity conservatives are conservatives, who want wastefulness-of-LivingOpportunity to be eradicated, so that we can be inhabiting it, instead of allowint it to be eradicated/wasted..

etc.

I'd begin with the correct qualification of the version of "conservative" that a person is claiming.

Corrupt privilege-conservatives ought be called such, & not let get-away-with claiming that the're the rightful definers of "conservative".

This should go for all "conservative" & "liberal" identifications:

Let people claim whatever variant they want, and then enforce accountability through matching their actual-behavior against their claims, with indestructible public accountability.

_ /\ _

People demonize both sides of the political spectrum. But the left is absolutely has this issue a lot more making conservatives out to be the most comically evil people.

Please answer in good-faith

Lol, good luck with that.