When you finally get to watch Discovery and realize it isn't actually an enormous pile of mugato dung

It's pretty bad. Comparing it to other Trek or not. Writing is atrocious. Much of the acting is bad. Crying Captain crying damn near every episode. Not developing much of the bridge crew over 5 years. Not to mention not remembering their own rules (I remember once they said they couldn't jump while cloaked, and then they did it).
Stamets, Saru, and Georgiou were they only ones that kept me watching.
If others can find joy in it, sounds good to me, but I'll pass thanks.
- It's pretty terrible, not terrible enough to not see. The main problem is they made it very very difficult to care at all about anyone. Burnam is the most intollerable captain ever, they barely develop any character at all, and if they do, it's only to kill them immediately after and try and squeeze some easy feelings from us. Well developed characters are instead falsely killed, but ultimately protected by plot armor. As you mentioned, Stamets and Saru are the only really decent guys.
  
  The acting is fine. The issue is the genre.
  Discovery is melodrama, something previous series explicitly were not.
- See, I’m torn. Because ST often gets weird and goofy, but DIS seemed to take that to another level with some REALLY questionable writing, directing, and acting at times. But that said, the big showpiece that DIS brings to the table - and imo, absolutely hits out of the park - is the pervasive theme of radical acceptance. For all the cringe and facepalm moments that the show has, THAT is a huge win - and in fact, goes to the very core of what the UFoP is supposed to represent both in-universe and in the context of fandom.
  
  What exactly were you missing in other shows that was accepted here (besides wild subordination and actual mutiny)? I have to say I felt somewhat uncomfortable with the amount of emotion they show during their work. I have no problem with the show exploring that, but these people are supposed to be professionals, having them cry during every shift doesn't really give that impression

Personally, I was overall disappointed with DIS. But when watching it there was the occasional moment that I loved. Lorca was a great character (until they did the haha he's actually super space Hitler rug-pull), much of the props, set designs, and costumes were great, Mudd was superb, it introduced us to Anson Mount's Pike and led to SNW, Saru was genuinely one of the most interesting characters in all of Trek, etc.
It also had a bunch of stuff that I just really really didn't like. But meh. That's just, like, my opinion maaaaann.
- (until they did the haha he’s actually super space Hitler rug-pull)
  My guy, they had him admit to blowing up his own vessel and killing everyone on board. He openly ignored Starfleets protocols surrounding new life and sentient life by sanctioning the effective torture of a creature to power the spore drive. He rejected admirals and went against their orders frequently. He slept with a gun under his pillow. He was shown to be collecting torture implements that are psychotically illegal from the entire galaxy and having a creepy room filled with those implements that also happened to have its own independent brig.
  It isn't much of a rug pull if you looked down at any point...
  Edit: -
  He was also gathering navigational data the entire time and actively punched in extra coordinates into the Spore Drive from the Captains Chair. He then gave a long stare into the camera and said "Lets go home".
  He was exceptionally pragmatic in military strategy which isn't so common in Starfleet in general.
  The season is also littered with mirror imagery. First time Lorca is introduced is through a reflection in his window. Stamets has his mirror moment in episode 4.
  He's also littered with scars, including ones that are consistent with the shape of an Agonizer. He showed extreme interest in someone willing to break one of the biggest rules in Starfleet and used his power to pull her into his reach through some wildly sketchy means.
  The light sensitivity wasn't an obvious one as it was a new thing, it was used to canonize why all the Mirror Universe episodes in DS9 and Enterprise are dimly lit and darker, but even that hints that he's not 'normal'.
  He also behaved weirdly with Admiral Cornwall who knew him well and she even mentions that he's not the same person she knew.
  He actively set her up for something he suspected to be an ambush and then refused to go save her despite risking the ship repeatedly before. Something Saru even questioned at the time.
  He's even eating the same food that Burnham is served in the Mirror Universe.
  Like I said. Isn't much of a rug pull if you look down.
  
  He was still far more interesting to me as a guy suffering from PTSD and having to often choose between two bad options. There are a lot of ways a character like that can grow and evolve.
- I thought the last two seasons were good, but 4 was great. I still don't recommend it though because of the first three.

It's almost like people throw a fit over everything new for little reason other than not what they're used to. TNG was whined about. Ds9. Voyager. Discovery is in good company. Still Trek, no matter what anyone whines otherwise
- Ds9: where's the exploring? They're on a space station!
  Voyager: where are all the aliens we know about?
  Enterprise: it's been a long road.
  With time, they all got their space. (This is me agreeing)
  
  All Trek is equal.
  With the exception of Code of Honor and that racist ass shit they wrote for Chakotay
- Voyager is the only series, Kate Mulgrew & Robert Picardo will save us all.
  
  Save us indeed. From Robert Beltran...
- I'm just happy to have new Trek shows after like 15 years lol and now there's SO many
  Plus, DIS really got into the groove after the first 2 seasons, which is a common problem IMO for many Trek series from TNG to ENT
  
  Up until Lower Decks, no Star Trek show had a good first season. Most of them had a rocky second as well. Also why I balk everytime someone says "Yeah I watched the first couple episodes of the first season and gave up." But you sat through the first season of TNG and the first 3 of Voyager with no issue?! Seasons that are twice as long?!
- Maybe it's simply that the format changes a lot.
  TNG is much different from TOS and some people don't like that style.
  I can honestly say that I find Discovery extremely frantic, boring and way too contemporary, but that's just my expectation towards Trek. Others have different tastes.
  
  Maybe it’s simply that the format changes a lot.
  Then that makes the complaints even more pointless. If the format and style of the series changes continuously then what basis do people have for whining that it "doesn't feel like Star Trek"?
  I feel that frequently a lot of complaints about the show are directed towards the entire series as a whole. That Discovery doesn't fit for whatever reason. Yet these people are the ones who are wrapping up so much variety throughout the shows to one 'feeling' and when it doesn't fit they check out.
  Yeah, if you don't like that style that's perfectly fine. Personally I don't like the style of DS9. But I'm not out here saying that because it's different than what I am used to and what I like that it "isn't Star Trek" or "doesn't feel like Star Trek."
  I've said this before but Star Trek shows off diversity through as many aliens and characters as they can. Why are people so angry when the shows themselves do the same thing?
  
  extremely frantic
  Yes! I didn't know what was wrong with it but that's it. It's like a movie trailer where they put everything in to get viewers to watch the movie but it's 50 minutes long.
- When The Last Jedi came out I went to see it with some friends who were big Star Wars fans. I thought it was fun, they hated all of it. I said to them "I guess I am not big enough of a Star Wars fan to hate Star Wars that much." The same is true for almost everything.
  
  I've been a Star Wars fan for almost three decades and I think almost all Disney Star Wars is "fine" at worst. Even most of the things I didn't like had some sort of redeeming qualities, or I could recognize that I wasn't the target audience. The only thing I truly hated was Rise of the Skywalker, which is quite possibly my least favourite Star Wars thing ever.
  I realize this puts me in the very small minority among Star Wars fans, and it's the reason I tend to avoid fan discussions these days - the relentless negativity is exhausting and leaves little room for discussing the things about Disney Star Wars I find good and/or interesting.
  
  I am a big Star Wars fan and TLJ is the only one of the three I think is actually good. Though, admittedly, TFA is fun if you shut your brain off and don't think about it.
  
  Yup. Proudly love the Sequels too. There are some flaws in them, don't get me wrong, but it's new Star Wars that expanded on what we got. Personally I found that a thousand times more interesting than the endless void of fanfiction being peddled as 'believe in whatever you prefer!'
- Nah.
  Lower Decks and SNW is generally well liked even though it's new and not what people are used to (LD is a wacky cartoon comedy).
  Both TNG and DS9 were bad shows in the beginning (DS9 could be described as ok-ish, but it ran concurrently to TNG in its prime, so looked worse in comparison). Fans didn't dislike them because they were new and then got use to them, they disliked them because they started out bad and then liked them because they got better. VOY and Enterprise are generally considered bad to highly flawed (ENT 3rd season being the exception because, again, it was good).
  There are PLENTY of reasons not to like Discovery. You enjoyed it? Great, have fun. No need to dismiss people not liking it because it's new or whatever.

My main complaint is common to Picard: I don't think the season long arcs were a good idea. I felt like maybe that had enough story for a "two parter" but stretched out to a season because "streamers binge".

I did watch it, that's how I know I don't like it it didn't take everyone else's views and make them my own.
- Same, I needed more after SNW and wasn't quite ready for the way 80's - '00s era Trek was filmed. I actually liked the first two seasons and thought season 3 was okay.
  Spoiler alert:
  But then we learned about the source of the burn.
  And then season 4 happened. And then season 5 happened. It felt like all of these were leaning into my least favorite things about Discovery. By the finale, I was fast forwarding through everything just to get through it.
  Watching TNG for the first time now and loving it way more than Disco :)
  
  Yeah, I got through season 3 and just let it go after that. Like the other seasons, the first half had me, but the endings killed it for me. And the endings just kept. Getting. Worse.
  
  Watching TNG for the first time now and loving it way more than Disco :)
  There's so much to look forward to! It is a bit dated and I watch it through rose-colored glasses, but even with that in mind, it's a good show.
- I salute your integrity 🫡

Dunno what show you watched. But I thought it was trash.

Yeah, my only complaints with it overall are the insanely high stakes every season. The format of the show is hyper-serialized by design, so each season is a 10-13 hour movie which appears to make "high stakes" a requirement. Once you accept that and go along for the ride, it is quite enjoyable.
That said, I do prefer the episodic format of SNW and LD.
- That’s why I like Strange New Worlds better.
- Yeah, which makes the burn story kinda flop at the end. It was a good idea, a resource everyone has become dependent on becomes scarce. There was a lot of untaped potential there IMO, but a great premise. Then it gets turned into this asnine root cause. They could have done so much better. Imagine if they turned it into a tragedy of the commons. A warp superhighway wore a crack in subspace and that interacted with a nebula or something. It was a death of a thousand cuts and everyone ignored it. Maybe Starfleet even knew it could happen but ignored it because that's how they have always done it, and even if Starfleet stopped the cardasians and the gorn etc would still be using dilithum based warp bubbles (excuse after excuse)... Heavy handed, maybe, but more meaningful.
- Totally second everything you state. The characters are absolutely great too, but the season story arcs with just incredible stakes are not my cup of tea. Serialized and packaged story EPs are preferred. That said I enjoy it for what it is.

Is discovery the one with the weird looking Klingons?
- Yes, the one where I'm 90% sure season 1 is some other IP that had Star Treks skin stretched over it.
  
  I still maintain that season 1 of Disco was a sly attempt to reboot all of trek into the alternate timeline Calvin-verse. I can't prove this though. To me, the aesthetics are all a closer match to what's going on in the recent Trek movies than anything done before all that. Season 2 saw the producers backpedal hard after fan backlash.
- They steered them back towards normal looking after the first season for what it’s worth. They literally have a character comment, “Oh hey, you’re all growing beards again.”
  
  The hair was one thing, but also their skin tone. Every previous Klingon has had a "human" skin tone. But in Discovery, each Klingon is entirely either a sort of dark blue, charcoal, or just straight up black.
  
  Reminds me of that TOS / DS9 crossover episode where Worf is like, "We don't talk about that with outsiders" lol

But it is. Very much so.

I think a lot of the criticism of DISCO is overblown. It’s definitely a fun watch, but it never really feels like Star Trek. It feels like an action sci-fi show wearing a heavy coat of Star Trek paint.
It was good once I accepted it for what it is and stopped expecting it to be something like what I generally expect Star Trek to be.
- That's what a lot of modern Sci fi shows are doing these days, it seems.
  Like the "Halo" show. It very much feels like someone took their idea for a show that got shot down, used find+replace to redo all the names and places to make it "halo" and got greenlit. And honestly I think I might have liked it as it's own thing.
- People that had qaulity shows for decades expect quality. If you want to make a scifi show either don't call it Star Trek or accept the criticism
  
  The criticism is worthless though as 95% of it was applied to every other new Trek to be released

It sucks soooo much.

It’s the only Star Trek show I’ve struggled to get through. It became the show I put on in the background while I was ironing my laundry.
I’ve watched everything else except Enterprise and Prodigy.
Stamets is one of the better parts of the show, though.
- Enterprise is a little campy but really awesome.
- I really do honestly recommend Enterprise. It has highs and lows, but some of the highs are WAY high. There's some of the best of Trek hidden away in Enterprise.

I thought Disco was pretty good, but it kept diverging further and further from what feels like Star Trek
- I thought it got closer over time. Season 1 tired maybe a bit too hard to feel "new and fresh", but they reined it in a lot later on. I mean, obviously bringing the SNW Enterprise crew in for Season 2 was a bit of a mission statement, but the entire back half of the show is all about getting back to Trek status quo.
  
  It's the classic hero's journey, where the hero starts out grumpily going along with the journey, but by the end, taking the lessons to heart and standing as exemplar to those ideals
- Season 1 that was true where was trying to be grim dark. But I'd say that was actually one of the things they fixed.

Care to elaborate? Didn't watch it yet, this is an honest question.
- Discovery is very divisive among viewers. People seem to really like it or really hate it with not much in between. Both sides have valid arguments, but people forgot there is a middle ground.
  
  Yeah I'm in the middle. More positive than negative, but I'm not a fan, especially of the 2 first seasons, it became better after the time jump.
  However, even the first seasons do not deserve the hate we see.
  
  Discovery, especially the last 2 seasons are very, very inclusive. Which pisses some people off.
  Next to that everything is debated. Sometimes way too long. And if you cant look past that it's sure to annoy you very much.
- There's few different criticisms of DISCO. From different perspectives
  People who are concerned with canon have issues with the first couple of seasons because it's set before TOS but has had a big visual reboot. They'd also probably argue that some of the story elements don't fit in with canon.
  The first season (at least) doesn't feel very star trek, it's got this whole grim dark thing going on. That is thankfully dropped later and you do get the normal hopefully outlook.
  Characters aren't developed very well. Even by the end I don't think we've got to know anyone other than maybe Stamets and Tilly.
  Plots often rely on the mystery box format, which has been disappointing when they don't stick the landing
  Plots are over whole seasons, when they probably don't need to be.
  Because of 5 production often started before writing had finished, and it shows. So you end up with a good start, a bunch of meandering, and then suddenly bam you're at the final crisis.
  I often find it an OK show.
  I also find it quite frustrating that after the time jump they didn't take the opportunity to tell some different more interesting stories. Grappling with how society would have changed unimaginably for this crew compared to what they're used too (like in the forever war when we hear how earth has changed), or grappling with genetic modification (in show the eugenics wars were over a millennium ago at this point - surely the federation would have gotten over one species bad experience with it) etc etc.
- Watch it without reading any critic reviews first, is my opinion. (When I watched Enterprise, it just so happened my opinions aligned with other people's complaints. I am glad I watched it first though.)
  Things that people found divisive, I really didn't. Some changes probably caught everyone off guard, hence the major controversy of season 1, but at least it was plausible that the change could align with the rest of the Star Trek universe in some way. Maybe.
  Like most other new shows, it can be a bit rocky as the writers develop the story and underlying theme.

- I'll think you'll find it's Ubiquitous, Mendacious Polyglottal Donkey ball
  
  Nice reference there!

My personal highlight in DIS was the start of S3, when Burnham amd Book were cruising around with his ship. I thought "Yeah, that could be nice. Star Trek that's not playing on a Federation ship? That could be a nice change of pace". Then two episodes later they abandonded that and returned to the same old.

I thought this was about the discovery channel... and didn't understand anything from the comments

I absolutely heckin' loved it

Michelle Yeoh carried the show in the episodes she appeared in. Otherwise it is Bantha poodoo.

Right? It's pretty solid.
I think it's a shame the show ended on a bit of a downer, but season 1 is underrated and 2-4 are actually very watchable. I think my power rankings are 4>2>3>1>5, but I could change that in a rewatch.

My reaction when someone says they don't like Disco:

I really wish it had gotten seven seasons. By the end the episodes were getting really good, and I think they could have made it great with more time
- Personally I thought season 4 was great.
- I wished the last three seasons had been longer, like the first one; imagine the story arcs we could have gotten!

Ugh, I would jump in the reactor and realign the warp core for Stamets any day.

I really loved Discovery. It had a couple of weird issues (stupid turbolift fight while appearing to flow through ridiculously empty space), but for the rest, it was amazing.

I find the first seasons pretty good, than it turns weird and then lukewarm.
- Interesting. I think the first season is beyond abysmal but if you stick with it it picks up!
  
  Really? I thought it found its place a lot faster than other Trek shows. TNG had a terrible first and middling second, DS9 is my overall favorite but it doesn’t pick up until very late in the third season.

Oh hey, someone found a kumato?
- Loves me some moogatoes

Some good, but many many meh episodes.
To be frank.. if I had to choose between Discovery and Enterprise, I'd take Enterprise.
- I’ll choose the Enterprise theme song over Michael’s incessant crying and moping any day of the week.

My issue is with the camera work. There is way too much camera movement and it makes me physically uncomfortable to watch.

Haters will always whine about what they hate. If you enjoy something they don't it causes them pain.

Except it is. I gave up watching after the third episode
- That just means you're weak
  
  Or I just don't want some super violent crap TV show. It gave me zero reasons to want to continue watching