Remote View

5mo ago

Are you cisgender? Gender Survey Result: Majority of active Hexbear users say No and Maybe.

Various thoughts:

Around 20 people weren't properly covered by the gender categories, obviously we're trying to be as inclusive as possible and a different approach will be tried next time
There were about 600 respondents, which gives us a accurate sampling of the active userbase. If you multiply any number by 3, you'll get a fairly accurate representation of the full userbase each week. This means there are around 800-900 people who don't identify fully as cis each week on this site.
Nearly 300 trans/gender diverse/questioning people unanimously agree that hexbear is an inclusive space
There was so much data on gender that I was really struggling to find a way to convey the data that wasnt a pie chart, graph, or an incomprehensible kalaeidoscope. If you have an idea on how to beautify the data, you can download the raw data here: https://pad.artemislena.eu/file/#/2/file/xzy4pck8on+oZp9yGRUIezR+/ - I further anonymized this data by removing time of response and any specific comments, I don't think it would be easy for anyone to figure out who is who.
There were a couple of text responses that really needed further elaboration, I noted hexbear's rules next to these comments
I'll probably be doing a demographics survey sometime in the future, including basic fairly anonymous stuff like "what region were you born in" "where do the languages you speak originate" "would you describe yourself as a POC" "what age range are you in".
The percentage of people answering they were cisgender increased by 8% than the previous survey. This could be for a myriad of reasons, such as cis people being afraid trans people will hunt them down in the public thread and assassinate them. Anonymity may have made them feel safer to respond. Regardless, way more people responded this time, which signifies that people felt safer responding to the cryptpad or it was easier to do. The leading question was a bit more inclusive than last time, but I think I'll include both questions (are you transgender / gender diverse and are you cisgender) to see how people respond.
We have a lot of people that aren't binary trans on this site.
Some of the questions were pretty funky and we got a lot of fuzzy responses on them as a result. In particular "After you realized you were trans/gender diverse, how long did it take for you to begin to act on it?" and "At what age did you begin transition?" caused a lot of friction, I think I will ask more vague questions in the future that lead to a path of more specific questions to capture better data, and to save people time. Questions like "Do you feel your gender transition had a defined starting point?" and some further ones.
Around 20 people each week on this site are cis she/hers, which is very low and roughly the same as last time. I feel like if hexbear ever starts hosting other federated stuff (like a federated tiktok or something) and can hook into it natively with lemmy, we'd see a better ratio.
I tried to be very sure any data with >2 people on it was clearly legible, I think some people might find it fun that there are others with their same fairly specific classifications per this survey lurking around on the site.
Overall I feel like the survey was a success despite some bumps.
You can find the other surveys/links here: https://hexbear.net/post/3016455
I made these graphs on company time

transgender @lemmy.ml

marcie (she/her) @lemmy.ml

5mo ago

Are you cisgender? Gender Survey Result: Majority of active Hexbear users say No and Maybe.

36 4

Trans @lemmygrad.ml

kristina [she/her] @hexbear.net

5mo ago

Are you cisgender? Gender Survey Result: Majority of active Hexbear users say No and Maybe.

34 0

162 comments

Someone should post this on /r/mtf and /r/ftm and some of the enby subreddits, just saying. Share it around, maybe we'll get new friends!

And maybe edit the prolewiki https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Hexbear
- Would be funny to crosspost it onto Lemmy.ml and watch libs mald that leftists are better at making an inclusive and safe space for our trans comrades than they are again, though I'm pretty sure that would also coincide with harassment again, which should obviously be avoided.
  Edit: shoutout to marcie, she even crossposted it to blahaj.zone. wonder if a few visit Hexbear in response?
  
  Uncritical support to marcies crusade against Lemmy
- @ledlecreeper27@lemmygrad.ml new survey for you

shoutout to the 7 cis women on here
- 😘
  not just cis, but old, too 🧓💅 I don't leave snail trails; I leave dust bunnies
  
  thank you for your service
  
  Cheers to you!
  
  Not old (late 20s, tbh don't consider 42 old though there's definitely a mildly intimidating age/experience gap sometimes, but if you own the label go for it) but mad respect for you rocking out here (is that how you say it in your generation?)
  TBH I just had a really cool chat with a (she said she was in her 60s?) indigenous Chilean auntie who had a pretty decent power level (leftist level) at least from what I could tell. And I guess I chat with an Iranian (probably also same age range) auntie once in a while (well twice so far) as well who is pretty decent... Restored that bit of faith in IRL (imperial core) humanity that needs resuscitating every now and then tbh. Maybe in time I should try to see if they'd be interested...
  
  Old gang old gang

IRL I assume most people are cis.
On hexbear I assume most people are trans.

Around 20 people each week on this site are cis women
I'm sorry to have to bring this up again, but your survery had no instruments to accurately measure that. It once more had no option to say if you're a woman (i noticed, because that meant that i couldn't accurately state my gender until i picked "other" and used the free text field). Only "are you cis or trans" and "which pronouns do you use", which does not enable you to accurately assess people's genders. PRONOUNS =/= GENDER. Cis women could go with none / use name, comrade or they / them for opsec reasons or because they do not want to be targeted by the many misogynist weirdos on this site or because they want to normalize gender neutral language. I know several cis women IRL who at least sometimes do this in online communities. In this survery, you wouldn't know if they're women. Or she / her may simply not be the pronouns that fit them. There was at least one cis woman with hy / hym pronouns in the replies to the survey.
In future surverys, i'd abandon the approach to infer gender from pronouns, stick with the option to tick multiple boxes, but just add man and woman to the list.
- good point tbh, true, edited that. i try to avoid specifics generally because people seem to hate specifics on these forms, gender is a fickle creature
  
  Ah, i see. I think the option to tick multiple boxes does a lot to mitigate that, though. When i look at problematic examples i can think of, it's usually forms that have either "woman" or "transgender - MtF" or some shit like that as different options, where unconditional womanhood is implied to only be available to cis women. But if you have cis and trans, nonbinary and binary, inter, agender etc. all as seperate, not mutually exclusive, combinable categories, you avoid that. Like, if i want to answer truthfully, i absolutely have to pick woman because womanhood is such a core part of how my gender works, but i also can't possibly seperate it from being trans, or from existing outside of a binarist system. And with a "pick any that apply" kind of wording, you include all that. Having options that exactly describe just one specific gender identity do not really work when you're surveying a gender-diverse crowd because there's so many identities and so much potential overlap between them. So i think it's best to break this down into possible components.
- There was at least one cis woman with hy / hym pronouns in the replies to the survey
  
  hi, glad to be causing trouble and confusing the narrative lmao 😎
  but yeah i'm very keen of the idea that pronouns =/= gender, but that seems kind of hard for most people offline (even in many lgbt spaces) to get their head around. or the idea of neopronouns. god forbid you do both lmao
  ngl i got wayyyyyyy more upbears and responses to that comment than i expected from a stream of consiousness/vent about misogyny and gender stereotypes and my Situation™ and i got kind of scared lol. shoutout to the encouraging replies and reading recommendations tho
- Is the opsec reason that valid in an anonymous survey? Unless they think the admins would use that info to target them if they left any specific comments or they thought IP might be used to identify them. Seems like it would be pretty uncommon and might catch as many eggs as it does cis people lying for opsec reasons.
  Still, certainly better not to make such assumption than to make those assumptions. Especially with options like comrade that can be appealing regardless of gender identity.
  
  Is the opsec reason that valid in an anonymous survey?
  The survery asked for the pronouns used on hexbear.
  
  There's no way to view IP on the Cryptpad AFAIK, and the website its on doesn't log IP, its only in ram long enough to finish downloading a request, and even then its anonymized. Owner of the site is trans I'm in one of her group chats. I also edited out timestamps and comments in the raw data.
  If you did the survey through VPN or tor browser there is essentially no risk
- This is true. I know of at least one cis woman on the site that doesn't use she/her, though I don't think they answered the survey.

the jokes about Xi save us and defense/denial of worker/minority abuse in China make us look bad, (etc etc) No different than libs defending Klanmala "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" (etc etc) Han supremacism no more acceptable than white supremacism (no shit), Dengism killed wholesome chungus communism, China surveillance state
Wew. Also no one is defending worker/minority abuse (the surveillance state in China I will defend, let's not kid ourselves socialist societies are under siege, were born under siege, etc etc) or claiming China is a utopia. And comparing support of AES to Klanmala support is straight up lib shit (and crying about Dengism is both ignoring dialectal materialism, and your western lowkey chauvinist, dogmatist opinion of AES). cringe

As for the comment about transmisogynism (while I'm not the one who mentioned it), somewhat yeah. And there's def an issue of orientalist attitudes towards anime (as someone who is Asian), there is shit but wypipo/westerners' and other cultures' shit has its own issues. "Asian (specifically Asian) cartoon bad because (insert stereotypes here)" is tired y'all
And yeah I called out people who posted their opinions, anonymously, who I don't know who they are... deal with it
- I am once again begging anti-Dengists to explain Historical Materialism
  
  I really don't know how you'd square the Dengist healthcare reforms with historical materialism.
  Though I've never seen an anti-China leftist seriously talk about them.
- Never Stop Dunking
- the jokes about Xi save us and defense/denial of worker/minority abuse in China make us look bad, (etc etc) No different than libs defending Klanmala "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" (etc etc) Han supremacism no more acceptable than white supremacism (no shit), Dengism killed wholesome chungus communism, China surveillance state
  White supremacy is worse for the simple reason that it has been institutionalized in multiple countries and is the bedrock of capitalism. Han supremacy is limited to individuals. The PRC hasn't institutionalized Han supremacy and in fact has taken steps to combat it. Why else would the One Child policy exclude ethnic minorities from it? Like, you could find the mass graves of dead Indigenous children in residential schools. Not sure how anything the PRC has ever done is comparable to that.
  
  100% agreed, from the start the CPC has been explicitly anti-Han supremacy. And all the cracKKKers and cracKKKer-worshippers are hideous for comparing their crimes- of genocide across the majority of entire continents, of supremacist rule across the entire planet (even in regions not directly colonized like Iran, Japan, Ethiopia, the interior of China, etc- the "extraterritoriality" clauses imposed for instance), to whatever chauvinism may exist in China (which they at least have genuinely worked against).
  Everything they accuse China of is projection. I've lived in the prairies and was mostly raised rural there, and I've seen the conditions of the indigenous peoples there. The majority of first nations people I've known- including childhood friends, classmates, etc- were all adopted by white, Christian families, some of them rather questionable at that. I've seen (not extensively, granted) the sheer poverty of the reserves. I've seen and heard the anti-indigenous racism here, the squatter-mentality of settlers whose biases then naturally go on to translate to large numbers of missing (and "missing") indigenous women- and men- which translate to police brutality, to the cases of coerced sterilization and other medical malpractices as gain attention now and then, etc...
  CracKKKerdom truly has no shame, no remorse, and absolutely no moral restraint whatsoever (nor concept of morals, simply excuses to justify the maximal amount of violence and exploitation against other humans). The entire west needs de-Nazification/to have imperialism purged from their societies, and by their regimes' derangement they might very well force the rest of humanity to go in and thoroughly purge the illness- I'd hope not, but it's not out of the question and increasingly it seems likely.
- True. And I mean I dunk on anime sometimes here as well (while having an anime pfp)
- the jokes about Xi save us
  I am not joking

Great work! Re: low cis women, I know one of them IRL, and she's trying to basically wean off all Social Media, so she very rarely posts or comments here (but she did respond to the survey). Not sure how to get more ciswomen or transmen to join, honestly, but it's great to see that everyone feels safe here!
Edit: it's clear that misogyny is one of the most commonly pointed out issues with this site, based on reading replies and input from other comrades. I am fully in favor of a purge, even if it would be unpopular, it's better to confront issues and remove the problem elements. It's important for every user to feel as safe and comfortable in every bit of this site (except the EM/POC community threads for whites and trans community threads for cis, obviously safe spaces would be maintained as such). Maybe another weekly megathread as a safe space? A Feminism community sounds cool too and would be a good place to hold that, I think. Maybe include comm sidebars with feminist literature and theory? Just spitballing here.
On that note, if anyone has felt that I have been guilty of misogyny, I'd greatly appreciate being re-educated so I can be a better comrade and make this a safer space for women, enbies, and other non-masculine comrades.
- Also techically I at least am one of those "has lived a life of a cis woman" who answered "maybe" types that might be able to voice that maybe only in a space like this. I am thinking of a kind of autigender thing and the way women mask and have to mask their identities.
  
  Yep, the person I am referring to doesn't list her pronouns, she tries to mask more online more often than not. Same concept.

YOU CAN JUST CALL ME OUT BY NAME, COWARD
- oppression

I have recommended hexbear to two cis women and they did not like it. Both are socialst, but they said that hexbear is "pro russia" and "pro Iran"... typical western "socialists"
- No, their issue is only with Islamic groups and russia. Sadly, a lot of what people know about the "islamic groups" has been twisted, almost like it's been fed to them by big satan himself. I have a deep dislike for capitalist russia, and sometimes that even turns into irrational hatred, but that's just from my personal experiences with russian soldiers during the second chechen war. I know that's not the right take when it comes to the conflict in ukraine, though.
- I get it
- your friends are pro-genocide i guess
  hey look I can be needlessly reductive also
  
  I guess you are right. Anti-genocide but anti-restistance does not work.

you can tell it's from a leftist forum because one of the genders is a whole paragraph

Practically no cis-women wtf
- yeah maybe around 20 per week, though a fun fact is we have around 24-30+ trans he/hims on here which was much more than i thought!
- Yeah, I wonder about the lemmy-wide statistics for this
- "Very male-dominated" in a context where more than half of the userbase on the site is transfem is pretty yikes tbh. Yes, i know, you were talking about reddit, but still, it just feels weird to argue like that. Especially when reddit has a lot more cis women using the site than hexbear.
  There is something on here that actively repels cis women, and i gotta be honest here, it's probably you guys. Dudes on hexbear have a serious misogyny problem, i have never seen a thread about relationship issues etc. that wasn't full of incel shit, the dunks always get more vicious when they're directed at women, i honestly wouldn't spend any time here if the site wasn't at least good at banning transphobes. We need similar purges for misogynists, which, btw, is something that has been called for over and over again in the trans mega.

So, 49% of us are being sent to re-education camps? When do the busses leave?

I find it amusing that a recurring sentiment seems to be that Hexbear is too weird and embarrassing.
Should we be piss posting less?

I put “maybe” as my answer for if I would recommend hexbear to my trans friends. It’s still true, but I think that because of the answer I put I didn’t get to talk about the caveats I would have to tell them first, so I’ll put them here. It’s really more of a “maybe leaning towards no” answer for the following reasons.
- piggybacking for a moment. i peruse the modlog quite a bit & have seen a depressing amount of body shaming & even ableism from prominent users. i, too, am the comfiest within the confides of the mega.
  i'm a system, even if i don't present as such here. so
- I have thin privilege, but I would definitely be very wary of recommending hexbear to the fat trans people in my life.
  As an admittedly currently fat trans person, someone's weight wouldn't play a role in whether I'd recommend them or not. People aren't shitting on others for weight here, but having conversations about wanting to lose weight (or gain weight, for those seriously underweight) is something pretty much universal (and not just in chud/etc ways, health is also a universal reason). That's not to disregard that it's affected you personally, and maybe (since I can imagine it would affect many people) we should be requiring spoilers for such discussions, etc... (no opinion/not necessary for myself IMO)
  The misogyny and anti-system shit is totally and utterly unjustified, though, and something absolutely has to be done about both.
- Thank you for bringing up the weight thing. I have been meaning to effort post about this for some time, but haven't dared do it yet.
  I think there is also an issue with a kind of trust in a linear progress of modernity when it comes to medical professionals and medical science that maybe comes from privilege. There are also all kinds of neoliberal self-control/self-betterment things that I have seen here that ignore the systems we live in and how they are different for non-normative bodies. These have made me very uncomfortable as a person with an uterus especially. The treatment fat bodies get in this world and from medical experts especially is systemically violent and the "issue" of fatness itself can be contested. For example NovoNordisk funds the researchers in o*esity and it's just a huge thing of racism, pathriarchy and medical violence that leftists should do better with.
  This for sure is one of the more unwelcoming things here for me personally.
- pardon my ignorance, but what do you mean with the "anti-system shit"? I'm confused

what gender type/category best describes you
Dyke and a half
:wheeze:

Hexbear is a little weird/embarrassing
- I wish the recommendation question had the option to pick "yes and it's a little bit weird/embarrassing"
- ?
  
  So many posts about piss and pissing

Misogyny may be a bannable offense, but it most certainly bleeds through often enough that there are days where I feel very uncomfortable on this website. Some of the threads that pop up from time to time are absolutely disgusting.
- Very important to report when a post makes you uncomfortable! We'll send out a death squad quickly!
  
  I have.
- Sorry you feel that way. Could you let me know what kind of comments you're referring to? I want to make sure I avoid any behavior that makes you and others uncomfortable.
  
  I've spent some time away from this website and recently made a new account for it. There have been no offenders recently. In the past, it was always those fucking dating threads or anything involving dating advice for men and my reports were only heeded half the fucking time.
- When you see a misogynist, call them a misogynist, I'll back you up. No we we not be entertaining debate perverts.
  I still get pretty nervous about being dogpiled when I call bullshit out, but it's always been taken pretty well. I know its exhausting, but if people arent held up to a mirror theyre never going to learn, and for the most part people here will listen.
  It took years to work through this shit myself and I'm still not perfect obviously. Its embarrassing when it happens, but its good when someone tells you off.
  This goes for anything.
  At least report them, shout out to the mods.
  
  I do report them and those reports are rarely heeded. And I'm not going to engage these fuckheads when I'm a woman and they're being misogynist.

This is amazing work. Thank you for putting this all together.

Do I understand correctly that there are appoximately 7 x 3 = 21 cis women on this whole site?
ETA: I didn't originally count the ones who had she/her as the secondary pronoun. So that would be 10 x 3 = 30 cis women.
- Side effect of descent from reddit unfortunately imo.
  
  idk I think reddit has more cis women than that.
- weird corollary, we also only have 6 x 3 = 18 trans men on the site, so a total of maybe 40ish AFAB binary-gender people on the site. there are likely more if we count nonbinary people and those who choose not to disclose their pronouns, but oof, even with an extremely optimistic guess that doubles the number above, we're still looking at under 5% of active users being AFAB.
  damn, I sorta want to start a struggle session thread for the prevalence of AMAB people on this site. it's really bizarre to me, as a transfeminine enby, how being in, or not in, online spaces like lemmy, reddit, discord, and such tends to stick through transition.
  
  Counting everyone in "are you cis gender? Yes, by pronoun" who doesn't include he/him or as one of their choices, it is 52 x 3 = 156. It's 9% of responses at the absolute most optimistic. But there isn't really any reason to believe that would be the case.
  In terms of people in the "No, by pronoun" and "maybe, by pronoun" sections, I don't think we can really infer anything about AMAB vs AFAB without specifically asking. You could find any combination in reality. An AFAB person can use she/her pronouns but not identify as cisgender. No reason why not. IME AFAB people are more likely to identify as not cisgender than AMAB people. In some situations she/they is basically the default.

This could be for a myriad of reasons, such as cis people being afraid trans people will hunt them down in the public thread and assassinate them.
Was looking to get my ear pierced anyway.

the blade that performs DIY bottom surgery on the patriarchy

There's a small percentage chance that you'll crack an egg with a badpost, but it's never 0.

Also anonymous my ass, y'all will know exactly who this is :3
You're anonymous to me, Comrade.

Have fun and take care out there.

more questions for cises
Quizzies for cissies

who decided that 300 letter long lines would be good for that screenshot should uh, reconsider
- Limitations of software unfortunately, if you want to you can take a crack at the raw data
  
  stick that shit in a hundred 3d pie charts, god damn graph nerds

This should be submitted as a masters thesis
- Average traa post

Allow more than two sets of pronouns
My people! (None of those are me, I didn't answer)

Never thought I'd say this, but we really gotta start breaking up all that pink. Really funny counterpoint to the NB side of the chart. Let a million splits bloom!
And to all the "custom pronouns please" respondents: an attempt was made, and it was almost exclusively used to be shitty about neopronouns. A nice request process would be pleasant, though.