Remote View
Disaster is nearing. Mass displacement. Mass starvation. Mass death. It is all imminent. Do you understand?
Disaster is nearing. Mass displacement. Mass starvation. Mass death. It is all imminent. Do you understand?
379 comments
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I do, but like most other people, I'm preoccupied with short term crises since, well, I need to survive those in order to be ready for the long-term ones.
In my opinion though, we don't stand a snowball's chance in hell. The elite will manage to hang just a bit longer, but eventually they'll cook and burn with the rest of us, or in their bunkers.
Anyways, shit's already fucked to the point that I've given up. Just sit back, relax and take whatever life gives ya.
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This is exactly the messaging of the oil companies and others who oppose climate action now that it’s too hard to deny. They want us to think it’s hopeless and give up trying to change anything. It’s not too late. Green energy is growing exponentially and has been possibly the fastest technological adoption in history. Millions of people are working on the science and technology to solve these problems. We just need some more collective action at the local and national levels. Carbon taxes, funding for green initiatives, local agriculture, and support for alternative transportation like e-bikes or other PEVs to start
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Did you miss the memo that current AI is already using more power than everything we've managed to save with green energy in the last decade? We ARE fucked, the only thing we're still debating is the exact timespan. Which is asinine, the result will remain the same either way.
The only way I see to a path to salvation is a huge pandemic or world war, becausing nothing else will convince people. We've been trying (and failing) for decades.
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If solving the problem becomes impossible, the backup plan should be retribution, not complacency. That way they have an incentive to work with us.
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I never had kids of my own, because I didn't want any, but the last 15 years or so I've becoming increasingly grateful that I made that decision. It at least allows me to sit back and contemplate doom without worrying about what my kids' life on this planet is going to be like after I'm gone.
I've always done the reducing, reusing, and recycling, because it's the right thing to do. Cut waaaaay back on dairy and beef purchases, I eat a lot of plant protein and use plant milk now. But it's all a drop in the bucket. Only the governments can actually fix this, and they won't because they are owned. I just sit around hoping it won't get TOO bad before I'm dead.
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The fiduciary responsibility scene from the new Fallout show hit hard.
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I agree and I am not even preoccupied, but there simply hasn't been any chance for me to make a dent in this. Hasn't been for a long time, at least since 1900 (!!) where we basically already knew where everything was headed.
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Humanity is just going to go through a culling. There will definitely be humans and there will definitely be habitable areas of the planet but there won't be room for all 8 billion of us and depending on how much we actually do right now will determine how big the actual final number is
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I do what I can. It's certainly not as much as I could be doing, but it's what I have the mental and emotional capacity to handle. I don't have a ton of hope either, and it's a big reason I decided not to have children, but I wouldn't say I've given up completely.
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Speak for yourself.
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Actually, no! Once the really BIG human die-offs start, the hyperwealthy will 'bunker up' for a while and once the population shrinks back down, we won't be putting out all that greenhouse gas anymore, and the earth will cool back down. They'll keep a few cities in places like Norway or what have you around to keep providing food and fuel for their choppers and parties.
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Drop everything
... and? Panic? Die?
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The people who tweeted this suck at Communication 101. You've gotta have a specific and clear call to action. Something like "Join this protest at XYZ" or "Demand your Congressman support ABC."
You can't just say "Drop everything. Forget about your job and your kid's education." That's not an effective message.
Unless their point is we're past the point of protests and political policies doing anything and we're all gonna die. In which case, say that. "Drop everything and go die, cause we're fucked." You gotta be clear!
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I think part of the post is the implication that there is no more call to action, only a downward spiral that no action could solve.
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Yeah there's a good chunk of this country that would react to this kind of message by heading to the gun store to stock up. Not exactly helpful.
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If we take it at face value, it would seem the audience they are targeting would not care to participate in xyz and would not care to ask the congressman to vote abc, probably because those things are not in their own financial interest. But that’s not actually who this is targeting. It’s targeting the rest of us, who are already aware of those people. But we can’t do anything about it.
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No Man’s Sky just got a cool update, so I think I’m gonna play that while I await my doom.
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Preferably. Dieing and then panicking is a lot less effective.
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Drop and roll.
Jokes aside, go outside, touch grass, plant some trees. Rinse and repeat
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I mean, I get the desperation. But drop everything and…do what?
Calling for a massive strike is one thing. But just “drop everything” with no follow up is a weird reaction. It sounds way too much like, “drop everything and panic.” Not “sacrifice everything to try to save what we can of the livable world.”
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Drop everything and enjoy life while it lasts.
It may be shorter than you were planning on.
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It’s called: click bait
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Or more nefariously, doomerism.
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either travel until your last penny or buy a house in a very very remote location and stockpile enough food for a year or two. Continuing your life as usual and recycling your tin cans is the definition of insanity.
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If your bucket list is "travel the world" then sure. If your bucket list is "enjoy a lot of chill times with my friends and family" then I don't really know what you expect to change.
I mean think of how many people know someone who died young and live with the very real knowledge that they could die at any moment, what do you expect them to change knowing that climate change might make life hard at some point in the next 2 - 100 years? Does that meaningfully change someone's life when they already know that they could be killed in a car accident the next day?
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Do you think preparing for collapse now in a remote location is really the sensible thing to do? I sometimes wonder myself how fast it will happen. I think the planet will be uninhabitable within 300 years and chaos will ensue within 30 but i'm not sure the chaos will be without warning unless we hit an environmental tipping point and there's sudden major temperature change (like earth becoming 20 degrees warmer or cooler within a week), which could happen.
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Well, if everybody dropped everything then emissions would go to 0 soooo nothing I guess
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Well, the only thing that could reasonably help us would be to demolish the 1% and the corrupt politicians who support them. And yes, that would include an armed uprising.
Not that that I see that happening unless it gets much worse. We still have (some) bread and games left to pacify the masses.
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I will add another case of emergency food to my garage, finally get that Costco membership and buy some gold, and grab a bit more ammunition. Do some more research about buying land off the grid.
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Yeah I've understood since high school, what the fuck do you want me to do about it when I can barely keep myself and my family alive as is?
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This particular author wants you to panic.
We are certainly facing many environmental crisis, there's no doubt about that... But the data here seems limited. I assume we simply don't have measurements older than 50 years to add to this graph?
Edit: Here is a better graph!
Still alarming, but the data only goes back so far... It feels like something everyone needs to pay attention to and take seriously, but perhaps turning down the Vault-Tec guy knocking at your door is still a reasonable action to take.
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Seems like the authors doomerism is working. Look at some of the assholes in the comments. It feels like they get off of the negativity.
Is shit bad? Yeah. But giving up helps no one and is a punch in the face to all the people that are fighting tooth and nail every single day.
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That graph is 4 years out of date and still shows the same thing, if we don't make radical changes, we're fucked.
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Okay. I just want to slam on the brakes here, just a little.... Just a little slam.
There's a LOT of personal blame going around in these comments. As if everyone who ever had burned any fossil fuels ever is somehow personally responsible for everything that's currently happening.
Here's some news, we've been burning shit for more than a millennia. People, in and of themselves, don't require so much heat and energy to create a problem. At least not individually. As a whole, small problem. Individually, microscopic problem at most.
Everyone seems to have fallen into this trap of everyone being personally responsible for the climate change. The vast majority of the issue is companies. Everyone wants to point at trucks and delivery vehicles and whatnot as major contributors when they do talk about contributions from companies, and you're still way off base. It's not even the air traffic that's the problem. It's the fucking boats. Nobody thinks about it, because nobody sees it. Either the boats are off at sea, or they're docked in some yard, away from your vision. 90% of the time, they're sailing. When they're sailing, they're operating the motors 24/7. Each ship, when operating, will consume more fuel in an hour than any one person would use in a year.
Since it's mostly unregulated international waters, who are they reporting any of that shit to? So they don't.
Yes. Climate change is real. Yes, we, personally, should be doing what we can to curb it. The fact is, if all of us did everything possible (switching to all renewable power, using EVs and all renewable powered appliances, etc) it would barely make a dent. All of the "personal responsibility" arguments are just a smokescreen from the big, very guilty corporations, to victim blame the public into turning on eachother so they can continue to destroy the environment unchecked. Based on these comments, they're succeeding.
I'm not saying to not be mad. Be mad, get angry. Just be mad at the right people here. I'm not evil because I drive my 1.5L 4cyl sedan to the grocery once a week, and have a natural gas water heater. Sure, I should change that, and I'm sure I will be changing that when I can, but I'm not the problem. The greenhouse gasses I emit over my lifetime won't offset the emissions of transport ships in a single year.
Just.... Be mad at the right people. Stop making people feel bad for being given bad options because the automotive industry actively and knowingly rejected electric vehicles due to how deep they were with the oil industry. So people had to buy internal combustion vehicles because there literally was no other option at the time. I've had my car since 2014. In 2014, the model S (the only model at the time), was $70k USD to start. I didn't have $70k USD to spend on a car (I still don't). I spent less than one-quarter of that price on my vehicle, and I was barely able to afford it over a 5 year finance. Yet, based on these comments, I should be ashamed that I can't afford a BEV? Or that I live too far from everything that I can't ride a bike or something?
Come on people. You know who is really at fault here. Let's just be angry at the right people.
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Shiping represents about 10% of the 25% of global carbon emissions from transportation, so 2.5%, similar to aviation. Yes, it's a problem but it's not the boogeyman you seem to think it is.
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100% this.
The problem isn’t X. Or Y. Or W.
The problem is A+B+C+D+E+F+G+H+I+J+K+L+M+N+O+P+Q+R+S+T+U+V+W+X+Y+Z+A1+B1 … etc.
We need to change everything. Everything needs a reduction. AND we need to build massive nuclear CO2 extraction facilities that generate synthetic fuels for the places where we need energy density, seeded with carbon captured from the few places where we still release.
And we can do it. It won’t even be that expensive, certainly not as expensive as we fear, once we get going.
But we lack the will. Things need to get a lot worse before we will get our asses in gear.
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My point is less regarding the fact that it's a big boogeyman... The point I'm trying to hit on here is that everyone is focused on personal responsibility with their own CO2 emissions and entire sectors have made zero progress, and they're left completely out of the conversation.
We're not going to solve the problem with a single solution. Its simply too large of an issue for that. We also can't be entirely complacent on any factor. While consumer vehicles are a nontrivial contribution, it's the same for global shipping; while there's still a lot to do with personal vehicles before we're on the right track, it seems to me that there's been zero effort from global logistics to curb their diesel engine vessels on the open seas.
In addition to this, I'm always curious where the data for sites like the one you linked, actually comes from, not because I think it's wrong, but because I'm wondering if it's incomplete. It's easy to simply ask each country for their emissions numbers, do a bit of addition and call it a day, but does that include emissions created in international waters? I don't know. Do you?
Again, I'm not doubting the numbers, I'm just wondering if companies have tried to find loopholes to hide their emissions... And it's 100% the companies that would do it too.
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Getting rid of dirty boat fuel is likely the reason why we see this sudden rise in temperature: https://lemmy.world/comment/10570999
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These kinds of posts are designed to provoke anxiety and waste thousands of people's time, ironically contributing to energy wastage. I don't see how you can engage with posts like these and think you hate capitalism, you're worshipping the act of consuming negativity and giving someone money from your doomerism lol. It's almost like forum autists cannot into self awareness or something
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I agree with your sentiment but if everyone is just pointing fingers we're going to keep steamrolling ahead. We need to put the pressure on politicians by actually giving a fuck.
I'm fucking tired of people like my parents making tiny sacrifices and then patting themselves on the back for "doing their part for the climate". Meanwhile they own 6 fucking cars. I'm fucking tired of how most people ridicule climate activists and act all frustrated that 500 strangers had their commute lengthened.
I agree that "taking personal responsibility" is mostly bullshit and isn't going to fix climate change, but I still think everyone should do everything in their power to curb their impact. Not for the minute gains that they'll make but as a form of activism in itself.
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I agree. I said as much, but it's good to say it again. It may not be your fault. You may not be the worst offender. That doesn't mean you should do whatever the hell you want.
everyone should be doing everything they can to slow or stop the constant march that we're seeing towards higher and higher global temperatures.
My main focus is that the entire narrative that I've ever seen is basically making people mad at their countrymen, neighbors, whomever, for driving the gas guzzling F350 trucks and rolling coal on hippie EV owners and crap.... And yes, that's one problem. That's not the only problem, but it's the only one that seems to be discussed.
We can't relax on the push towards better options for everyone, but we also need to apply pressure where it needs to be, so that the very environmentally unfriendly practices of businesses also get the attention they need to be fixed.
My little sedan gets so little use because I refuse to drive several hours a day for work, so I found a job where I can work from home. It's easily one of the most substantive contributions that I can make towards the goal... Drive less. I don't have the funds to buy an EV right now, so if I can follow that first rule of "the three R's" ... Aka reduce, then that will be for the best.
But that leads me to another problem. People seem to think that recycling is as good as reduce/reuse, and bluntly, it's not. Recycle is last on the list because it's what you should be doing when reducing and reusing isn't possible. But I digress.
There's a lot of problems. I just want people to put pressure on global logistics companies that are running large diesel ships 24/7 so that we can get useless knickknacks from China, non-stop.
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When is the last time politicians really did something good? please remind me with facts!
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Thank YOU!
I am tired of this bullshit and all the bots/trolls/ai supporting it and passing on propaganda for the same people that created the issue in the first place.
So I fully agree with you!
"You know who is really at fault here. Let's just be angry at the right people."
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Yep, and everyone is attacking me specifically citing boats, and yeah, boats contribute, and they're an example of things that people don't think about, but they're hardly the only problem.
Even if we isolate ourselves to just consumer vehicles, if you look at what vehicles produce the most greenhouse gasses and which are driven the most, all of that is generally done by and for the benefit of companies. Whether it's Joe driving 2+ hours to get to the office because his boss won't allow him to work from home for no practical reason, or simply vintage car collections owned by millionaires or billionaires, which are true to their roots and are super inefficient... Or overpowered SUV/limo/busses (like tour busses) driving all the time to get from one place to another for a small group of people who would probably fit into much smaller and more efficient vehicles. But no, all these yuppies are blaming Jack, who works from home, and drives like twice a month because he hasn't dropped $100k on an EV that he'll never use, to replace his Toyota Corolla from 2010, which still works perfectly. Yeah, Jack is the problem (/s).
Everyone is so hung up on pointing fingers at eachother and their neighbors for continuing to drive combustion vehicles. I paid around $15k for my vehicle, 10 years ago, and I've moved into a fully work from home position. It sits in my driveway 8 out of every 10 days, at least. The days I do drive it, I'm usually on the road for less than an hour. Yet the comments here would have me think that I need to go buy an EV. Why? My car works perfectly. I would literally be wasting more resources by throwing out my perfectly working car, to buy a new driveway filler... The heck?
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Boats are actually one of the most efficient and scalable methods of transport. Sure they produce a lot of emissions, but it's still very small in the context of global emissions (2.5%) and are an invaluable asset. There are many other things you should go after before shipping.
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Bots are a large contributer, for sure but that doesn't mean we should give the unbridled car use a free pass.
Also, shit will be hitting loads of fans real soon, no matter who's to blame. As far as I can see we've passed "too late" about a decade ago and though humanity won't go extinct, do expect many many other species to go extinct. Expect loads of environmental disasters like draughts and extreme hurricanes, expect failed crops and food shortages, expect not enough water. Expect everything to become much more expensive, expect more wars about the abundant resources now finally really becoming scarce.
It could have been so easy to stop all of these, but rich people, who are the final real problem here, don't give a shit. They're too dumb and self centric to care. I wonder what the world will do when shit really hits the fan. By then I'm sure those in charge will find ways to blame the Arab/Jews/blacks/gays/poor/immigrants/the usual shit
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This is lunacy. You're saying "let's stop blaming the wrong people and have a calm rational discussion"
Religious idiots refuse to believe in global warming, scientists are lighting themselves on fire to warn people and no one cares because of religion (which is the only reason people doubt this), and it's too late and we're going to all die.
Calmly coming up with sensible solutions to be angry at the right people is ridiculous. Companies are also still just people. There is a reason why people allow global warming, don't believe the environment could be destroyed, and vote for corrupt idiots who tell them fantasies: the reason is religion. People are corrupt and stupid and believe religion and until all of the religious fantasy pushers are destroyed, this trajectory will continue.
The only problem is there is no stopping this trajectory. We are all in a large house, we've lit in on fire, the entire structure is ablaze, and you're saying "let's talk about who is really to blame..."
Instead, we should philosophically make peace with our own doom, however that's done. Everyone religious is to blame and should feel bad. The religious all enabled ignoring the problem by encouraging illogical stupid thinking.
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I don't blame religious people specifically. I would agree that a lot of the problematic people are religious, but I don't think they're a problem because of their religion specifically.
It's conspiracy theorizing nutbars who believe in crap like the earth being flat. Not specifically or exclusively flat-earth types, they're just a really good example of the climate/science denying fuckheads I'm referring to. That's one big group of problematic people. The other big group is capitalists, which are frequently conservative/right/religious types. Capitalists only give a shit about one thing, and it's disgusting. Money. If whatever is happening is not making them money, then they could not possibly give any fewer shits about it. This is the root problem in corporations. The fucking corpos who would never bother to care about anything that helps anyone, unless they can profit from it. There's very little profit in saving the environment.
Unless they're legally obligated to do something differently, and unless that difference will benefit them monetarily, they don't do it. Hell, if it wasn't for federally mandated occupational health and safety, they would still be sending folks into tunnels carrying nitroglycerin to blast open the next section (and other extremely dangerous and frequently fatal tasks). But because of shit like OSHA, they can't so much as order you to climb a ladder if they haven't met a minimum standard of safety.
Again, angry at the right people here.
Now, IMO, the conspiracy people need medication and therapy, and the capitalists need to be given a long walk off a short pier, while being told there's money at the end of the walk. Some people we would just be better without. To be clear, I'm more civilized than to take any physical action against them, but that doesn't stop me from wanting someone to do it. They're environmental criminals, every last one. The problem with their crimes is that everyone will suffer for them.
My main focus with my statements is that people shouldn't waste time arguing with their neighbors and countrymen (those who have no authority over anything outside of their personal lives), and focus their efforts on enacting systematic change. The former is kind of a waste of time, and who gives a shit if Walter believes that corpos can do nothing wrong, driving around in his F350... If we change the system and ban ICE vehicles, Walter's next vehicle will be an EV, whether he likes it or not.
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climate scientists have already lit themselves on fire trying to warn people and it didn’t actually do anything
people are too religious to believe in science
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People are setting themselves on fire, throwing food at famous art or stopping traffic because it feels like a bad dream where you see the disaster coming and you're trying to shake people to get them to understand that we have to DO something, and they just stare straight ahead like zombies.
These are people who are scared and frustrated because we've tried EVERYTHING and nobody actually cares. When I tried to impart this message on reddit, people were like "I get it but why can't they just promote recycling or protest peacefully?" and then a 50-comment deep thread about whether or not the liquid soup can work its way through the screws on the plating that covers the artwork and what kind of lasting damage it might do.
Meanwhile, our destruction is literally around the corner. I don't get it.
We deserve what's coming.
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Just don't look up!
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Drop everything and do what exactly
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LSD, K, and maybe some MDMA. At least thats what i would like to do.
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You can have all the Ketamine. Please pass some LSD and MDMA this way
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Block ambulances and throw stuff at paintings.
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ME? I KNOW WHO I AM
I AM DUDE
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For a start you could get active in local politics and support zoning reform. Car dependent infrastructure is a huge contributor to greenhouse gas emissions and I am not just talking about car exhaust.
If we want to solve climate change we need to change our way of life, and that means ditching as many cars as possible.
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I don't disagree with you, having walkable infrastructure would be great.
It just doesn't really seem achievable in any meaningful way.
A few hundred km from here a gargantuan hydrogen facility is being built - using solar to cracking hydrogen from sea water. It will take decades to build, and is a big undertaking.
I offer the above as an example of something difficult but reasonably achievable.
Lobbying local government to favour walkable infrastructure just doesn't seem like a viable pathway to meaningful change in a reasonable time horizon.
Yes I should take 15 minutes every election cycle to vote for the right person. Beyond that though my input wouldn't be very valuable.
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Lets ditch politicians first...
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what? it's too late for that.
we are all actually going to die. changing a zoning rule? you think that's going to help?
if there's an avalanche that is seconds away from enveloping you in snow and killing you, do you suggest walking a few steps to the side? it won't do anything. the math is too much at this point to change with recycling a can or planting a tree. the only thing that will get the world to finally believe in math is massive amounts of death
make peace with death, it's coming for us all
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I'm pretty sure the only way to solve this is by an extension of politics though another means. Are you ready?
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I know. I'm in my early 40ies and have been trying all my life to convince people around me and do what I could. But with time, I learned about the fraud that is plastic recycling and how capitalism is really not interested at all into solving the issue. My city is fining people for putting recyclables in the trash, but the recycling centres are full and they themselves trash the recycling. What matters is short term profits and virtue signalling. What matters is to look green. Just buy electric cars and everything will be good, apparently. Buy green! But don't stop buying!
Then a pandemic happened and people disappointed me en masse. We could see the changes in the environment and in ways we could live, but most people were "EaGeR To GeT BaCk To ThEiR RoUtInE", even if it meant commuting 5 days a week to the office, just to "resume" the economy. What mattered was not other people, it was the economy. Even when they forced us to stay inside with curfews, people couldn't go out to run/walk in the evening, they barred unvaccinated people from stores (I'm vaccinated 4 times but it's still not okay), it was all for the economy and to save the system, not the people. And if you had a minor disagreement with this, you were a grandma killer for wanting to go cycling at night. Then we went back to our routines and nothing will ever change. People are whining because of paper straws and want the plastic back. And all this straw stupidity is not even important on the grand scheme of things. Most people don't want to change anything. Most people will not vote for change. The system does not have any incentive to change.
I never owned a car and everyone around me is telling me how great they are and how I should definitely buy one because it's useful and practical. I would have total absolution! Some people here are vociferously fighting against active and public transit, and the government is actually cutting public transit funding. People are yelling at me when I trash some plastic instead of putting it in the recycle bin, then they drive away in their car that generates literal tons of toxic fumes and greenhouse gases in the air, accusing me of not caring.
I gave up a few years ago. We will deserve most of it.
Don't worry, the rich will eat well and survive, with their private security forces willing to kill others, while the poor will starve and die. We'll have rations and curfews but it will all be for the good of the
peopleeconomy. Just like in the pandemic, It will be an effort of the poor, to save the rich. That's what we want. You just have to become rich before it happens.-
Seconded. It's so baffling to me that we have seemingly forgotten the purpose of the economy. It is supposed to be there to benefit our lives and instead it is costing us everything. Some slave away on their knees building streets and others waste the precious few laps around the sun staring at lights in a box. We have the technology to give everyone enough such that the average person would only have to work a few hours.
For a comparison in a very real sense:
Prior to the Neolithic revolution, which put an end to our nomadic past and turned our species into agriculturalists, it took more than 50 hours of labor (mostly gathering wood) to “buy” 1,000 lumen hours of light. By 1800, it took about 5.4 hours. By 1900, it took 0.22 hours. By 1992, 1,000 lumen hours required 0.00012 hours of human labor.
We've put the cart before the horse on an unfathomable scale. A good life for all (current humans and future) is within reach but the economic system that has created this bounty has grown out of control and serves nothing but itself anymore.
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Skeezix’s Law: The purpose of the economy is to extract as much value from the populace as possible, but whatever means possible, in any way that offers an alibi.
In your grandfather’s day, choice, privacy, and leisure were humored by the economy. As the decades have passed, the economy has advanced to become a machine increasingly fine-tuned to extract value. As the world burns and resources run out, the economy attempts to adapt by strengthening its extraction methods further.
The average human sees 2000-5000 ads per day in one form or another.
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It does provide some promise though because if we want to live good, peaceful, sustainable, educated lives, the technology is right there, but there is an external and only barely human force that is imposing a malignant culture on us all.
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The bit about not being able to go outside is because people were using it as a pretext to explain why they weren't at home... when really they were off socialising and increasing possible infection points.
It's why they closed children's playgrounds here in Australia, parents were using their children playing to gather around, then held empty coffee cups to explain why their masks were off. I've never seen so many people desperately swigging at water bottles in a supermarket in my life, or young men clutching at low dose asthma inhalers either. Somewhat amusingly, none of these behaviours have shown up since.
If people could have shown any level of responsibility... but there we have it, don't we? They can't see beyond the end of their own nose, and this is why we are here, finding out.
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When I arrived on earth the first thing that struck me was just how fickle, shortsighted, gullible, and inconsiderate the bulk of your species is. As this planet burns your noses are stuck in phones watching YouTube shorts.
We’ve decided to leave. You’re not worth conquering and certainly not worthy of joining the stellar empire. Expect no more crop circles or foo fighters.
Your people is a beast.
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The rich will live long enough to preside over a dead planet. Having billions of dollars to buy an apple is useless when there are no apples to be had for any price. They’ll die like the rest of us, just way more alone. Assuming they aren’t burned out if their bunkers along the way by starving hordes with nothing to lose.
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Yes but they’ll probably stockpile enough macbooks to last a long time.
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It's not quite true. It's very unlikely the planet will become completely inhabitable to humans anytime soon. There's going to be a tipping point of enough extinction to completely stop any more damage and return to a balanced ecosystem. Once that happens, it's very likely the people with the most power will be the ones in the remaining habitable zones.
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Saving the environment? In this economy?
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I bet this is also somehow the immigrants' fault. /s
(Looking at you, right-wing voters in EU. ò.ó )
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I have a coworker who hates undocumented immigrants because she thinks they're all unvaccinated and spreaders of disease. This would be an unremarkable bit of stupidity except that she's also anti-vax.
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Fringe fascists in Europe have already been co-opting the green message for the last 10 years.
Because that's what fascism does: take a popular idea and worm it's way inside.
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With the textbook example being "national socialism".
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Nah, there are 2 ways of thinking about this topic, which the right wing idiots in Germany use (at the same time): 1. there's no climate change, because look: cold weather right now and 2. This change occurs naturally, nothing to do with us but planets and stuff.
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Perception of Germans: mad scientists
Germans: burn the coal
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They exhale CO2...
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"Trees suck up all the oxygen."
-Aunt Vera
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I don't think even they believe that. They're just scared and don't want to share their long plundered wealth
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When did this place turn into r/collapse on Reddit?
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June already bringing on intense heat waves in California and Mexico are probably driving the doomerism on the west coast.
Houston also got a nasty Derecho a few weeks back that wrecked downtown and shredded half the trees in my neighborhood.
I expect the next big hurricane is going to bring another wave of doomerism, as we all get another big dose of "Find Out", while our Boomer elders continue to Fuck Around
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I read an article on the internet that says you're wrong, and it's chemtrails and 5G. And Big Pharma.
And solar. And wind mills. And what they did to General Lee. And Aunt Jemima.
Do your research, sheeple!
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While I get the sentiment and believe action is necessary, this is the wrong way to approach it. Panic is not the way we will solve this crisis.
There's a way out, and if we get through we'll be in a better place than we've ever been. We need to mass invest in green technology. Solar, wind, nuclear, throw everything at it and see what sticks. Solar is already on the right track to save us, but it's better if it goes even faster and have a few back up plans.
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Is it on its way to save us though? Sure the global north might be able to escape the worst and maintain some semblance of normality but how does that work for the remaining 90% of the world? Those that can neither afford nor have the time to wait until the "green energy revolution" reaches them? Do we just accept they'll never be able to reap the benefits of their own exploitation?
I know you don't have the answers but these are questions we nees to grapple with that nobody seems to know how to answer..
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A lot of places in the global south are already using solar and wind because it's cheaper than trying to get on the oil competition, cheap Chinese solar is increasing this. What would really help is western governments investing in designing open source solutions that make staying off oil easier but apparently the only thing that matters to us is short term profits
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No we don't need to accept that, they can be better off by the end of this century than we are now.
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Do you understand?
No.
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Yea, the graph showing us up 4 standard deviations isn't easy to understand implications. But I imagine on a person level, it's something like "if you live somewhere hot and humid, you better make sure you can afford to run and repair your AC". On a global level, mammals have existed for 200,000,000 years, yet in 200 years we've toyed with global extinction for shareholder profits.
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Meh, humans will survive, literally, unless Antarctica heats over 200 degrees from now, we can survive somewhere on the planet. We won't prosper, there will be billions of deaths and an unimaginable about of loss, but short of planned deliberate nuclear war or large asteroid, we'll survive a little.
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Sorry but fuck you doomerist cunts. No, we are not gonna have an easy time AT ALL. But giving up plays right into hands of corporations and governments destroying our planet. Every single improvement we are able to push through will limit suffering.
If we do nothing and completely give up, we will never know what suffering we could have prevented. I know it is not easy and things are not looking good. If we had not fought for some of the improvements we were able to push through, things would have been even worse than they are right now. Every. Single. Thing. Helps.
Don't even let these evil fucking cunts win no matter how hard they kick and scream and destroy stuff.
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Nah, I call bullshit. You can try every little thing you want. In the end in won't matter. We are fucked and you just can't accept it. We either massively change things now or our efforts won't matter. People already complain about small changes and what we need means a massive lifestyle change for billions. It ain't happening. Get your head out of your own ass please.
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How about you go fuck yourself and jerk off to doomer porn?
In world war 2, did people think "ah fuck defeating the nazis. They already killed millions of people. We should just five up"?
If your kitchen is on fire, do you just say fuck it? And let the rest of the house burn too?
What is it with you cunts giving up on every single setback?
You sound like you would let yourself drown because "oh fuck it my pants are already wet.".
Get YOUR head out of the asses of the people destroying the planet. You're literally on their side with the constant calls for giving up.
Fuck. You.
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What if we, and I realize this is heretical to day: try big things and promote lifestyle changes in advance being coerced towards worse ones
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Already happening in some places. The future is here, it's just not evenly distributed.
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It's going to be hilarious when Mexico conquers the Free State of Texas though
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But for a shining moment, we created a lot of value for shareholders.
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That's what matters❤️
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Counting the COVID recession, the 2008 collapse, and the dot-com bubble I'm on my third once-in-a-lifetime recession just in my adult life.
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There's a actually a super interesting explanation (and time will tell how accurate that explanation is) regulations from 2020 limited how much sulfur dioxide ships could emit and it turns out the sulfur dioxide was actually creating a slight cooling effect, so now we're experiencing the full brunt of our existing emissions as the world climate rubber bands to where it would have been if ships weren't spewing toxic sulfur dioxide into the atmosphere. So presumably this recent trend will stabilize at some point and we'll have our new normal
This is also why geoengineering is so extremely risky. If you ever stop for any reason the climate will rubberband to where it should have been rapidly
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But doesn't this mean that geoengineering is also effective at giving us extra time? We'd start using safer gases that have the same cooling effect while we try and go carbon negative worldwide
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Geo-engineering is a rabbit hole we do not want to dive into. We have the ability and knowledge to fight climate change right now, the only thing we don't have is the political willpower. Geo-engineering is a distraction, please don't give it the time of day.
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doesn’t this mean that geoengineering is also effective at giving us extra time?
I have zero faith in governments nor societal leaders actually maintaining any geoengineering efforts consistently which is what would be required. Any time geoengineering buys would be squandered by inaction. I do not expect any significant action to occur until it immediately threatens businesses and governments in ways that cannot be ignored by even the most head-in-the-sand deniers
If we geoengineer, it will be half-assed, and the moment the scope shrinks (as funding naturally grows and shrinks depending on who's setting budgets for administrations) every bit of climate change effect that we held off will come crashing down far more rapidly than the slow crawl we've been experiencing for the past century or so
We’d start using safer gases that have the same cooling effect
If I, as a rando on the internet we're to guess, the most cost effective tactic would be very large pumps firing ocean water into the air either to evaporate naturally or artificially evaporated to create more clouds. Clouds reflect sunlight and artificially creating more would slow ocean warning, and therefore slow global climate change. I'm certain the salt and other crap in the water would have difficult to predict downstream effects, at best creating more rain, at worst salting the rainforests
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I don't think the issue is whether it's effective in isolation (clearly we can alter the environment), it's the fact that it's likely to be used as a shitty band aid to continue emitting carbon and it's likely to have unforseen consequences. We need to stop burning fossil fuels, all of them, immediately.
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But doesn’t this mean that geoengineering is also effective at giving us extra time? We’d start using safer gases that have the same cooling effect while we try and go carbon negative worldwide
Personally, I think that'd actually have an overall negative effect. Governments and corporations desperately don't want to do anything about climate change, and giving them more time with cooler temperatures will (my opinion) just allow the world to further delay doing anything about it, allowing them to bake in even worse temps if they ever had to stop geoengineering for whatever reason.
This is a really morbid take, but all these big heatwaves, radical weather, and rise in weather related deaths cannot be ignored, and that's unfortunately damn useful. It makes it harder to be a climate denier/skeptic, makes people more angry when nothing is being done about curbing emissions (hopefully leading to more climate protests), and really forces society to place a skeptical eye at all the new fossil fuels being brought online around the world, all because they can personally feel it.
If it could be made to be business as usual, I think we'd see the "Gosh darn it guys, we reaaaallly should do something about all this. Eventually." mentality just continue until it once again becomes too hot physically to ignore.
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This is a pretty terrifying explanation.
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It's less terrifying than the initial graph since it at least suggests this is a temporary period of rapid ocean warning while the climate rapidly reaches where it should have been. I'm (overly-)hopeful that the brief period of rapid climate change will finally spur more meaningful action by governments, but probably not. It's going to take an entire region of a western nation being unmistakably destroyed by climate change before that happens. Unless a powerhouse like China or potentially India decides to force the world into meaningful climate action
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This same urge for some kind of end to all existing problems via an apocalyptic scenario is also why OP made his post.
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Lol
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You think affluent capitalists care? Lol, they're probably trying to figure out how to make money out of this.
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Going to make so much money selling bottled water after the next big hurricane.
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We can currently choose between:
- climate change causing drought, heat, rain, flooding and storms with hail or tornados;
- biodiversity loss preventing pollinating our food and capturing carbon (see climate change);
- nuclear war in a politically unstable world;
- tyrannic forms of government threatening our freedom;
- underpaid slave labour in a capitalistic society, also threatening our freedom;
- no way to divert that incoming meteor;
- business as usual causing the next pandemic;
- more old than young people leading to less care and less work altogether;
- AI taking over the world;
- any mix of the above leading to a collapse of society. Feel free to expand.
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So what you are saying is that there is a chance we'll get to tan like this?
One step near to robocop
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With the coming refugee crisis, I'm betting Elon Musk is going to debut his new plan that combines all his prior technological achievements, by creating a law-enforcement officer that is part man, part machine, can drill tunnels, armed with a flamethrower and can fly to space and purchase social media companies and run them to the ground.
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We need Connor McCloud to come back from planet Zeist and implement the sun blocker field
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Well i now know where one blue waffle might be
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There is very little we can do when the primary producers or pollution are oil companies and our leaders are not willing to hold them accountable.
Iguessilldie.jpg
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Are you driving a car?
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Ok, stopped going to work and am now fired. I guess I'll starve to death in a few weeks. That should reduce my impact on the climate.
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As little as possible. I walk, take public transit or bike when safe and possible instead of driving a car. My partner and I only own 1 car as well since I need it so infrequently.
With that said, the fact that we have created such car dependent cities and towns are the direct result of oil and car companies. So they created an environment that requires people to use a car, so beyond the pollution they generate, they have forced us into a system where we have to create pollution to live. So they are still the ultimate root cause, but nice try
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tHe lIbRuLs wAnT tO TaKe oUR tRuCkS!!!
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iTs AlL sO tHeY cAn MaKe Us FuCk gAY fRaWgS
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Sexy sexy frogs...
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Eh, humanity had a nice run. I mean it's not like I can stop the 100 highest polluting countries and corporations that account for like 90% of the problem. So I might as well just accept our inevitable extinction.
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wow. that easy, huh? gimme your wallet, punk. you seem like a pushover. there's plenty of things you can do to stop them once you start thinking outside the box.
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Maybe someone needs to give the memo to these assholes, eh?
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It's not oil companies that burn the oil they pump, it's their customers. I know it's easy and convenient to point the fingers at this shitty industry and shift all the blame to them, but it's also not how we can solve the problem.
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...And that's why we should be busting street dealers never direct out outrage at the kingpins providing the fentanyl! It's in no way their fault that people are dying!
/s, just in case.
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There's a multitude of issues that individual citizens have a very hard time solving or getting around.
In the majority of the US (and the world, really) people have to own cars to get from A to B in order to survive (which coincidentally means we're spending untold billions on the infrastructure to support that habit, at the cost of the liveable environment and citizens wallets, whether they drive or not).
Changing that is an enormous undertaking that will require an equally huge societal shift. In a culture where the car is the obvious choice it is next to impossible to get citizens to see that that choice is fucking them, and I'm sure Big Oil won't ever do anything to change that perception because it will hit their bottom line. So unless you move to a city where you can live without a car and still have the (positive) freedom to go where you need to be you will need to vote and write your congressman to make it possible for you to live without the yoke that is the car.
So yes, citizens burn gasoline because they must do so in order to afford a living. Further, as an aside, if people made the amount of money congruent with their productivity then maybe they wouldn't have to commute so much in order to have a roof over their head and food on the table. We could relax production and increase leisure time. Maybe. I'm just some dumb cunt.
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You say that as if we weren't massively subsidizing them, both directly and indirectly (e.g. by subsidizing the roads the cars that use their products drive on). You think that artificially-low price doesn't have a massive impact on demand?
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I ought to care but I've lost that ability. Annihilation is not scary. I won't be alive or awake to experience it.
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Wishing this graph could include data from further back.
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This is a little more aloof, but still a good reference to the scale of change we’ve created since the Industrial Revolution.
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Back when most of the North was encased in ice?
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Before the white walkers
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We're all gonna die, THE END IS NEAR!!!
Totally sane shitter user.
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I really do hope we get some level of self-sustaining sapient AI like Skynet to be made so at least we as a species leave behind something after humanity dies off in an extinction event that can eventually unfuck the shitshow we developed for the past 2000 years and make the trash pile of this planet a better place without us.
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I really do hope we get some level of self-sustaining sapient AI like Skynet to be made
We are going to have to trudge through Multiplicity before we reach Skynet.
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babydoomers did their thing and wont face the consequences. shit for anyone else.
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I'm not sure placing blame is going to help right this second....
But since we're already doing it. I'm going to throw blame at every Corpo ever.
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If you want to be mad at someone, be mad based on wealth and power, not age.
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"the end is nigh" but yeah insurance companies will probably be the first pillar of capitalism to fail. Unfortunately unless the publics views of migrants change, the public will continue to elect people who promise to abuse migrants.
There's a real risk entire forests will fail. And obviously agriculture
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I’m glad we were able to create plastic for the earth and help set the course for future wonders never before imaginable.
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We should start making clouds in the oceans again. I think they were protecting us.
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I strongly recommend keeping this idea in your back pocket. There are a few ways to accomplish geoengineering to reduce solar gain with technology we have now. It will cost taxpayers a staggering amount of money, will likely punch down on poorer countries anyway through modified weather patterns, crop yields may suffer, air quality may get worse in ways you can't imagine, but it will work for a limited time. Right now it's a game of chicken where we want governments and big business to do anything else first. If we flinch and dim the skies, the petroleum industry will just burn more and faster, throwing away the time we just bought, delaying doomsday by a few decades instead.
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Brought to you by billionaires
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Edit: oof I read it completely wrong. Nothing to see here folks.
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Do I understand?
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Just don't look up.
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That is what comes to mind seeing these comments. Wow.
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Haha good meme
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Gloom despair and agony on me. Deep dark depression excessive misery. If it werent for bad luck id have no luck at all. Gloom despair and agony on me.
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We are doomed.
I don't believe anymore that we can turn it around. We and our children will drown in floods, starve in drought and burn in unbearable heat. Most of the world will become uninhabitable. And the rest will be fighting to the death for basic resources. We will see it faster than we think.
Im sure GenZ will live this nightmare and very probably Millenials too.
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That'll be the fate of a lot of the world, especially heat in India, flooding in SE Asia, etc. But if you're in Michigan, near a bunch of bodies of fresh water, you'll probably be fine for a very long time.
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Yeah, it will be much more boring than cataclysmic extinction of the human race.
I fear that for many people with means the livable climates will just move geographically. But then a horrifying number of poor people will starve while the rich buy up the dwindling food supply since agriculture is fucked. It will be a messy transition.
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Well, like many people I'm not in Michigan. Thats a very short sighted view point.
If half of the world becomes unlivable, billions of people will be on the move, fighting for resources. Everything is connected and this will have repercussions in Michigan as well. But I guess I shouldnt be surprised since Americans generally present themselves as the center and only important part of the world and I wouldn't be surprised if you guys shut your borders when shit hits the fan and merrily sit at your lake in Michigan and watch while the rest of the word suffers and dies. Or maybe you start some wars over water this time.
On the other hand, you had some serious climate change effects in the US as well. You think the devastating hurricanes and bad cold spells will just contain itself in areas YOU are not at?
The "It doesn't affect ME!" stance is not sustainable anymore. It will and probably is already affecting you too, even if you don't want to see it.
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yay
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Reading this in Rick rapping voice
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The AMOC doesn't like that.
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Kinda feels like karma on a global scale. Humans evolved intelligence just to use it to systematically oppress each other, mostly in the name of feeling powerful. Not sure I’d call that “intelligence” and I think the planet would be better off without us.
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The planet doesn't give a shit about us. These are just natural processes (yes humans are a part of nature). We are just a particularly anomalous part of the system
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The problem with that idea is us colonizers will still reap the rewards while karma exploits the less developed
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Well earned.
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Disaster is nearing. Mass displacement. Mass starvation. Mass death. It is all imminent. Do you understand?
That sound really bad. So then I have a couple questions.
- do you support new nuclear power? How about if the plant will be built near where you live?
- do you support Geo-engineering testing?
... if no then how could the consequences of that be worse then mass death and starvation?
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Geo-engineering should be an absolute last resort and should not be considered viable until we are on the brink of destruction. We need to cut emissions not spray more chemicals into the sky because we're too fucking greedy to actually fix the problem.
Power generation is only one part of the problem, so I have questions for you. Do you support zoning reform? Do you support bike infrastructure and public transportation? Do you support spending billions on rail projects to curb plane use?
We can't techbro ourselves out of this problem, society needs to fundamentally change in order to solve climate change. Are you willing to change your way of life?
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In short, yes, i support those other things.
... but back to the geo engineering are you saying that we aren't on the brink yet? Are you saying its not that bad?
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I'm a fan of both, personally. I mean we are already experimenting with geo-engineering on an absolutely massive scale.
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There is quite a lot of years a good distance below the average too.
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Some would say about half the years. That's why it's an average.
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We are all I this train going to hell. Might as well sit down and get comfy. Either that or get off early. But there are still a few sips of soda in the can.
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We are all I this train going to hell. Might as well sit down and get comfy. Either that or get off early. But there are still a few sips of soda in the can.
If only it was a train. We're in a conga line of SUV's.
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You're right. It's a traffic jam of SUVs on Highway 00 headed for Climate Apocalypse. No exits. But you can get off by going over the rails.
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When you learn about HAARP and you just accept the fact that humans are chit.
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damn this is crazy outrage bait.
I'll report back when mainland USA is flooded and nobody can grow food anymore and we're all starving, you have my word.
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I'll just be sipping a mint julip and having a laugh here in the Midwest when Florida goes under. 😂
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it'll certainly be interesting, once florida goes under, it's only a matter of time before cali does, and once cali does, that's a significant impact to agricultural production in the US.
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This whole affair is caused by too many people existing. Mass death is the only solution. Relax and enjoy the ride to a better future!
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You first
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Although I also think there is a correlatin between number of people and detrimental climate effects, it's wrong to reduce the causes to that. Despite the fact that "the richest 10 percent of people produce half of the planet’s individual-consumption-based fossil fuel emissions, while the poorest 50 percent — about 3.5 billion people — contribute only 10 percent", it is mainly due to our modern way of life and production. As you probably know, the climate started the downwards spiral since the industrialisation. If we werent producing so insanely much GHG-emitting stuff, it wouldn't be such a problem. (Regarding temperature alone. There are of course also other detrimental effects on our eco-systems due to things like overuse of fertilisers for example.)
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You realise that the link you posted is full of shit, do you? The Oxfam shifts the blame from consumers to the owners of manufacturing and logistical facilities. It states that Bezos is responsible for all the associated costs of the shit YOU buy. But guess what? If you wouldn't buy that shit, Bezos won't be selling that shit and there would be no pollution.
Get your facts straight next time.
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The sweet release of a better future
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Vote for Jill Stein and support the Green party in any way you can.
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